Thursday, June 2, 2011

Game Listings

Just a quick note in advance of my next Pool of Radiance posting later: I have converted my "game rankings" Excel sheet to a Google spreadsheet (thanks to Canageek for showing me how easy it was, and to Wolf for giving me some particular motivation), and I have added a separate Google spreadsheet for my master game list.

Some points on the second one:

1. Please note that the list is current only through 2002. I have not fully reviewed the MobyGames databases for the years after that, only the Wikipedia list.

2. I welcome your comments and corrections, particularly on the original release date vs. the DOS/PC release date. I don't know if I have that right for all of the games on the list, and it's important since I'm playing in order of the DOS/PC release date.

3. Compilation packages should not appear on the list, so please let me know if you see one.

4. Multiplayer games should not appear on the list unless they also have a single-player mode, so please let me know if you see one.

5. For games that have undergone continuous development (e.g., many roguelikes), I will probably break them up into version categories and visit them multiple times. I need your advice on this, so if you know a game particularly well, please comment. I have already done this for NetHack.

6. As we get into more modern times, I'll have to make a decision between treating expansion packs as new games or as sequels. I'm leaning towards treating them as new games if they occur within the game's main plot (e.g., Baldur's Gate: Tales of the Sword Coast) but as separate games if they occur after the game's main plot (e.g., Baldur's Gate II: Throne of Bhaal).

7. It's not that I don't care about your opinion, but please, if you see something that you think is not a CRPG, don't bring it up now. I'll deal with that when I get to the game. I have my own method for evaluating that. If, however, my list misses something that is a CRPG, please do respond.

In any event, I'm sure I have a lot of errors and inconsistencies here, so please discuss.

178 comments:

  1. Just want to point out: your Blog is not IE7 friendly.
    Google Docs is complaining at me, and I am pretty sure the fact that I am using IE7 is why my Google Account stopped working too.
    I really can't wait until work upgrades our browsers.

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  2. Yeah, Netscape Navigator has some problems with it, too.

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  3. PetrusOctavianusJune 2, 2011 at 3:46 PM

    Netscape Navigator? That is like so totally the 1990's, dude.

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  4. Some online multiplayer games I spotted on the list (pretty sure none of these had offline single player modes, but anyone can correct me if I'm wrong): Meridian 59, Meridian 59: Vale of Sorrow, GemStone IV, The Realm, Asheron's Call, Asheron's Call 2: Fallen Kings, Runescape, Lineage: the Blood Pledge

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  5. Did you consider Waxworks (1992)? It's sort of a sequel to the Elvira series.

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  6. Yes, Petrus, that was supposed to be joke. 'Cause thelamebrain is using IE7, which is also pretty old. No one ever understands when I'm kidding.

    Thanks, Anon. I don't know what games have single-player options without reading reviews of them, and I haven't done it for all those games yet.

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    1. Should have gone with a Mosaic or Lynx reference and really thrown him for a loop.

      Started reading after the Game Informer interview at the rate of a couple entries every few nights, and I'm in the early January 2011 posts right now. I'll probably catch up by the time you get to the next game I'm really excited about, Legend of Faerghail since it's around 60 games away.

      Other games I'm interested in seeing your thoughts on are Arena and Daggerfall since you've obviously spent your share of time in their successors. I sunk my share of time in the latter (wish the later games still included the "climb" skill) but never played the former. There are others too but so many people seem to think the Elder Scrolls started with Morrowind or Oblivion, the older games deserve much more credit than they get.

      Also, Farscape is perhaps one of the most under-appreciated Sci-Fi series of the past 15 years. I don't know why it doesn't get the love of something like Firefly, maybe it lasted too long or the age of the DVD box set hadn't arrived at the time of its cancellation and series box sets cost in excess of $100 at the time. Who knows, I haven't looked into the Farscape game much at all, Giantbomb lists it as a RPG, maybe you could put it on the list just because.

      Thanks for the blog,
      The Piltdown Man

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    2. I've watched a couple episodes of Farscape, and man, it doesn't make any sense if you've not watched it since the start. Also: It seems to be *weird*, which would be a turn off for a lot of people.

      Yeah, can't wait to see him play Arena.

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    3. Farscape does have a strange vibe to it, and I could see why it would be a turn-off. I do tend to like shows a little less manic.

      Piltdown, I tried a few hours of both Arena and Daggerfall a few years ago, and I confess that I didn't like either. But I only played them briefly, so perhaps I will like them better this time around, with my six-hour rule in place.

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  7. PetrusOctavianusJune 3, 2011 at 3:26 AM

    Heh, shows you how much I know (and care) about Internet Explorer.

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  8. When you get to the next continually developed (would you say living?) roguelike I'll see if I have time to jump on IRC with some developers and get their input. Maybe even invite them to your blog if you are interested in that, most of the time they wont be the original developers though just the current ones.

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  9. I appreciate that UbAh. Do you see what the next one is?

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  10. Sorry I fell asleep and didn't see your question till now. Pushing myself to much for work...

    Anywho on to the discussion.

    I see Moria on your list way to late, I will have to find when the first dos release was but I remember playing it on dos way before the 90's. Of course memory is one of those tricky things so let me do a bit of research. But this was a very influential RL in that it was the first to have a town (released in (1983) and that changes tactics a bit as you can go up to sell/buy and recover. I dont know which version had the black market but that will help you with having something to spend money on. This one is what started my addiction to RL way back in junior high school on my dads 286. Those memories are why I think it was released for dos earlier unless my dad hacked the code and compiled it for dos himself, which I would not put beyond him.

    I think Moria is the most forked RL and its descendants are some of the most actively developed around. so you will see it and variations of it a bunch. The Angband variant was released in 1990 it think.

    If as I believe I find an earlier release, my recommendation is to insert it into your list when you are with a particular game that is dragging on you that way you give it a fair shake without a game your anticipating looming. That or as we are a way beyond the original release there may be various versions already out by the year your at, and you can play them together to compare and get a feel as to what it was like to see things evolve.

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  11. The DOS version of UMoria is actually quite a bit older than the 1992 date listed on MobyGames and your spreadsheet.

    MobyGames mentions that UMoria was released as a port of Moria in 1987, but I remember playing a DOS port of UMoria less than 2 years after that.

    The last official build was released by me in 1997 based on version 5.5.2 of the source code. I'm not sure how old the 5.5.2 source is.

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  12. Also, why is Final Fantasy III on the list? Not only was it never ported to PC, but it was never released outside of Japan until quite recently.

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  13. Thanks, HunterZ. I'm moving UMoria back to 1988, and I'll check it out in a few days.

    I know next-to-nothing about the FF series, and I'm not sure why I had it on there. I checked MobyGames, and they show a 2009 Windows release for a 1990 game!

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  14. Umoria version 4.83 (14th May, 1987 James E. Wilson)

    This looks to be the first PC version.

    some good release info here

    http://www.thangorodrim.net/history/version.txt

    I am still looking for where you can get some of the older versions so you can see the way the game changes over time.

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  15. UbAh: Here's something similar that's Moria-specific:

    http://beej.us/moria/files/pc/color5.4/history

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  16. Thanks HunterZ

    Do you happen to know where to get any of the old versions?

    Also I am trying to point our fearless addict to different versions that have changed enough to make it a new game experience. Any help here would be much appreciated.

    Also anyone who can help with this question as regards to the other major roguelikes that should be on the list and what versions at what dates, with links to where we can download 'em.

    One thing I would ask of Addict is to keep in mind that he is going back in time from where he is currently on his list, and even back before Omega. So with that in mind as you talk about the game, imagine the difference from rogue to this not necessarily Omega to this, as Omega came later.

    As an aside, I really like this "community" involvement to help out :-)

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  17. Unfortunately the Moria community (such as it is) hasn't made an effort to collect older versions. I did some Google searching and found a copy of what appears to be the last 4.x version at:
    http://www.umich.edu/~archive/msdos/un_indexed/mor4873.arc

    I also found another version differences write-up at http://www-math.bgsu.edu/~grabine/moriafaq/versions which suggests that 4.87 is the only 4.x version worth playing, and most anything 5.x before the current 5.5.2 is just more buggy.

    I should also mention that the most official page for UMoria is currently:
    http://remarque.org/~grabiner/moria.html

    ...and there's a FAQ worth reading (after playing, in CRPG Addict's case) at:
    http://remarque.org/~grabiner/moriafaq.html

    Beej's Moria Page is also well-known:
    http://beej.us/moria/

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  18. I guess I should get the latest and see if things didn't change to drastically till angband. Once we get to the bands there will be alot added to get where we are today.

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  19. Okay, give me the bottom line here. What version should I play first and in what game year should I play it?

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  20. I work 4 by 10's and after I get out today I start my weekend. Besides plans for a bbq and watching the fights Saturday I will be free to look around. Women in my life could change all that but such is life.

    So I will see what I can find that will actually work in dosbox and give you an opinion on which one you should try. If the latest Umoria plays like a bug fixed version of what I remember the original moria to be then you should be fine with just doing that one and not splitting it into separate games.

    Angband which should also be coming up soon was a split off the Moria codebase and it has continued to develope into a much larger game so there are indeed many distinct versions out there. The trick is to see if I or any of the other Addict addicts can find you working downloads for those versions.

    Anyway barring women and alcohol getting in the way I am on the case for this weekend.

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  21. Thanks. But, for my sake, please do your best to let women and alcohol get in the way.

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  22. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  23. I'd go with these dates:
    1988 for 4.87.
    1994 for 5.5.2.

    Apparently 5.5.2 has some new stuff added and some re-balancing compared to 4.87, but the core gameplay should be quite similar.

    I also work 4 10's as much as possible. It's nice!

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  24. HunterZ: did you find any dos binaries for those? Or sorcecode and I'll see if I can compile it in dosbox but I really would rather not.

    Addict: hehe I always let women and booze get in the way, but I should still have some time to play some good old moria :-) Everyone else always winds down before me after a party/get together/supperhappyfuntime. So I end up playing roguelikes drunk anyway, usually crawl stone soup

    Of course if by your statement your not looking forward to these games don't push yourself to do something you don't enjoy.

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  25. I already linked the 4.87 binary package, but I'll link both versions here for convenience:

    4.873: http://www.umich.edu/~archive/msdos/un_indexed/mor4873.arc

    5.5.2: http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dmswaine/m552-386.zip

    I haven't checked to be sure, but both of them should run fine in DOSBox.

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  26. You sir have made my drunken weekend, now I can just play instead of google. We'll see if I can't kill that balrog yet!

    If I were to blog my gaming it would be something like: Watch this Drunken Fool Play Games. I would just put videos of myself dieing over and over in a roguelike getting steadily more inebriated.

    Now I am really looking forward to my weekend :-)

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  27. @UbAh: That could actually be pretty funny if you edited the video to play in fast-motion.

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  28. OK now I admit I have been drinking a good bunch of hours now, but I have to thank you for this. I have been playing the versions of moria provided by my good man HunterZ and its such great fun remembering my high school days. I think that at the heart is why your blog is so popular, hell why I personally like it so much, because it helps us reminisce and remember our youth.

    Now some people who may be young and have no idea what it is to age may say that the above statement sounds sad, but I say reliving those times, happy or not, are just a part of the human experience.

    I applaud this blog and all its works as it has made me happy this weekend!

    I kinda lost track of my point at the beginning of this but I would say so far that the versions of Moria are basically the same in terms of game play and goal but the differences are in terms of the number of monsters and interface commands. so IMHO you should be good with the last link HunterZ gave, but you make your own decision.

    OK I am out to see if I can kill the Balrog and I just have to say thank you spellcheck cuz man does it help!

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  29. Moria is now on my 1988 list, and it will come up in a few games. Thanks for all the advice.

    I'm glad you're having fun, UbAh. If you start that blog, I will follow. I hope you were already drunk when you wrote "dieing," though.

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  30. I have a suggestion regarding your master game list. Please play the original Ultima V, not a remake.

    What I really liked in your posts about Ultima series is how you describe the progress of the game mechanics and engine in each part, not just the story. Even though this "Lazarus" supposedly has the same story (haven't played it), it's not the same game.

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  31. Addict: Nope I am just bad at spelling, and I was in a rush at work trying to finish typing that post and finish my day so I didn't proof. Not that I proof what I write all that often anyway, so I hope my mistakes don't grate on you too much.

    Now I was very drunk in that last post but it didn't come out as unreadable as I worried it would be, which is nice.

    Moria is still fun for me but I do find myself spoiled by the newer roguelikes with much nicer interfaces and tweeks to improve gameplay. Speaking of nicer roguelikes, Angband should be coming up soon on your list as far as the original release date, but I am not sure if the original version differed much from Umoria. I will have to check that out for you after I get tired of trying to kill the Balrog.

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  32. I'm definitely looking forward to CRPG Addict's comparison of Angband to Moria, since I never really gave Angband a chance.

    The biggest thing I've noticed in newer roguelikes that Moria lacks is the ability to fire ranged weapons/magic in more than just the 8 cardinal directions.

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  33. Hey, 'non. I'm not going to play the "Lazarus" remake as my main game. I just added that note to remind me to check it out during play and mention it at some point.

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  34. PetrusOctavianusJune 21, 2011 at 4:33 AM

    1988 seems to be a turning point in CRPG history with more good games released that one year than in all the previous years combined.

    My own list of games to play as part of my own project to play games (but not _all_, only the good ones) chronologically looks like this, with the order based mostly on the time they were reviewed in CGW:

    1985 Bards's Tale 1
    Ultima IV
    Phantasie

    1986
    Might and Magic I
    Starflight

    1987
    Phantasie III
    Dungeon Master

    1988
    Wasteland
    Ultima V
    Bard's Tale 3
    Pool of Radiance
    Star Command
    Demons's Winter
    Times of Lore
    BattleTech: tCHI
    Might and Magic 2

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  35. Looks like a good list. I do occasionally enjoy playing a "bad" one, if only for the contrast. And it's fun when a bad game unveils some paradoxically good feature, like Questron II with its automap.

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  36. I just looked through your list and noticed that you have FATE (released in 2005) on there twice.

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  37. Well, that was pretty dumb of me. Thanks, 'Nym.

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  38. Addict:
    I was wondering if you would be interested in me setting up an IRC channel so your fans & you could chat from time to time. I know of a couple good networks for this, and would of course set you up as channel owner or op or whatever you prefer.

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  39. Hey, 'Geek. That does sound like something fun to try at least once, but let's revisit the idea in a month or so, okay? The next 30-45 days are going to be very tough for me.

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  40. Probably ought to consider Star Control 2 (and/or The Ur-Quan Masters, the open-source version made from the officially-released source code) since it's as much a Starflight-esque RPG as Protostar from what I can tell.

    I should also note that Star Control 1 is NOT an RPG by any stretch of the imagination. It's an action game that is basically a derivative of Spacewar!, one of the first digital computer games ever written. Star Control 2 retains the first game's combat style, but wraps it in a Starflight style game.

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  41. Alrighty, let me know.

    QUICK! What areas in the USA are having elections! Are any of the politicians named Chet? Go forth geeky horde!

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  42. No one else seems to call Star Control II a CRPG, but I've added it to the list on your recommendation.

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  43. Buck Rogers - Countdown to Doomsday is on your list. But is the sequel, Buck Rogers: Matrix Cubed (SSI, 1992) also on it?

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  44. Did you drop Legend of the Sword from your list? :-(

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  45. As I said in the other thread (which has more information), Langrisser for PC should be added to your list at either 1991 or 1998 (it's a re-release of a 1991 Genesis game, but with some notable upgrades). Langrisser II, which is on your list, should be taken off, as you won't be able to find it in English. If it's kept, then you should at least change the date from 2002 to 1998, the actual release date. Alternatively, if you ever actually have a reason to play Langrisser II, you should play the translated Genesis game or the translated SNES remake (Der Langrisser. Langrisser I's best version, on the other hand, is certainly the PC translation.

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  46. I just realized that you actually also have Langrisser I on the list. However, it's under the title of the 1991 U.S.-localized Genesis release: Warsong. Still, the dating is wrong, and it should be called Langrisser I anyway. There was never a PC release under the title Warsong.
    Again, it should be dated to 1991 (for the original Genesis release) or 1998 (the year the PC version actually came out).

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  47. Langrisser is about as much of a CRPG as Fire Emblem is. It's a fantasy setting, and you control multiple characters, but otherwise it's a fairly linear strategy game, not dissimilar to Chess if Chess had different attack and defence statistics on each piece.

    As much as I like the Langrisser series, it's just not a CRPG, and due to how slow it can be to move individual troops (never mind the generals) with the addition of the fact that making a fatal mistake on a scenario can cost you an hour or more in time, it just doesn't seem like something The CRPG Addict would put on his list.

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  48. "As much as I like the Langrisser series, it's just not a CRPG, and due to how slow it can be to move individual troops (never mind the generals) with the addition of the fact that making a fatal mistake on a scenario can cost you an hour or more in time, it just doesn't seem like something The CRPG Addict would put on his list. "

    I largely agree, but he already has Langrisser II on his list (with the wrong date). Also, it meets all of the three points he outlined in another post - http://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2011/03/game-50-war-in-middle-earth-1988.html

    It has non-puzzle based inventories, character leveling and development, and combat based on at least partially attribute-derived statistics.

    I would totally understand if he didn't play it, but, given it's listing on MobyGames and his own rules, I wouldn't be surprised if he at least gave it a shot.

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  49. "with the addition of the fact that making a fatal mistake on a scenario can cost you an hour or more in time"

    It seems like some of his favorite games do this, haha. I mean, come on. He started with Rogue(!!!)

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  50. How about Circuit's Edge from 1990? Didn't see it on your master list. Granted, it's got some quasi point-and-click adventure game bits in it, but it definitely leans more towards the RPG side of things in terms of gameplay (random combat encounters, traversing the map in a 1st-person dungeon crawler style, having to rest and feed yourself, gathering and upgrading equipment, etc).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit's_Edge

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  51. Matthew, everyone seems to list Circuit's Edge as an adventure game, but Wikipedia says it's a RPG hybrid, so I'll check it out when I get there. Thanks!

    'Nym, Buck Rogers: Matrix Cubed is right there in 1992.

    Petrus, I can't remember what happened with Legend of the Sword. I might have downloaded it, fiddled with it, and rejected it as a CRPG, or maybe I couldn't find a good source. Let me research and reconsider.

    Killias2, I made the adjustments to the two games as you noted. Thanks for the information!

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  52. Something else I thought about bringing to your attention if you weren't already aware of it... I know '91 is still a fair distance away for you at the moment, but... Neverwinter Nights - one of the early MMORPG's that was hosted on AOL servers - is on your master list. I know you can still find the game to download around the web, but the actual online play was discontinued in 1997. So while you might be able to play it by yourself, the game as it was intended to be played is no longer an option.

    However, there is ForgottenWorld, which is more or less a clone of the original NWN. Still online and still playable. http://www.forgottenworld.com/default.aspx

    Also, when the time comes for you to cover NWN, if you'd like to gather comments/insights/inane banter from someone who played the original NWN when it was still online, I'd be happy to contribute somehow. (Again, I realize it's a long way off for you, but it doesn't hurt to be prepared, eh?).

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  53. Maybe you've discovered this already, but the entry for Final Fantasy III definitely does not belong in your list. The only release of that game in 2009 was for the Wii, not Windows (http://www.mobygames.com/game/final-fantasy-iii).

    There is also a graphically updated version of the game for the Nintendo DS, iPhone, and iPad, but last I checked you aren't playing iPhone games (http://www.mobygames.com/game/final-fantasy-iii_). ^_^

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  54. Gamma, where are you seeing that? The Google Docs version of that spreadsheet that's currently linked from my site doesn't have it.

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  55. Hi, found your blog recently and really enjoying it. I love RPGs, but missed most of these by not realising they existed. I did play Dungeon Master - and absolutely loved it at the time.

    Regarding your list, I'm looking forward to you playing the Realms of Arkania series because I played Blade of Destiny & Star Trail a couple of years ago. Enjoyed them but didn't finish...

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  56. I was idly flipping through your list just now and I saw Jones in the Fast Lane on your list. I'm a bit boggled as to how it could possibly be on there. It's a computer board game! It's like a cross between The Game of Life and the Sims, maybe. Nothing RPG about it.

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  57. Any chance the game Space 1889 might make it to the list? I noticed it is missing currently. Although being 1990 release there are still quite a few games ahead of it in the queue :)

    http://www.abandonia.com/en/games/28865/Space+1889.html

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  58. 'Nym, Space 1889 IS on the list, right there in 1990.

    Other 'Nym, I don't know about "Jones in the Fast Lane." All I did was copy down every game that MobyGames said is a RPG. I've discovered many that don't meet the definition, but I generally just weed them out as I get to them.

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  59. Hey Addict, what happened to BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Inception?
    Did you move it to the bottom of the 1988 list without even starting it? I though you had made a post or two about it, but now I can't find it.

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  60. I started playing it a while ago, but something turned me off about it, so I kicked it down the list. I have most of one posting written about it, so it shouldn't be too hard to prime the pump when I get back there.

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  61. You may want to move the 1989 game Death Bringer to 1988. It was orginally released in the UK in 1988 under the title Galdregon's Domain.

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  62. How about I just move it to first in 1989? It seems to have achieved a winter 1989 release in the U.S., which would make it one of the earlier games.

    I was thinking that for 1989, I'd try to order the games as they were released (at least roughly) instead of going in alphabetical order.

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  63. Moving it to the end of 1988/beginning of 1989 was what I too did.

    Having completed MM2 I am finished with my own playthrough of the 1988 games and I've compiled a chronological list of the 1989 games I'm gonna try. For those whose release dates I couldn't find I used the dates of the advertisments and reviews in CGW to deduce their order.
    This should be a mostly accurate chronological list, but if anyone else have more info please post.

    The Magic Candle January 1989
    Mines of Titan 22 February 1989
    Tangled Tales February 1989
    Keef the Thief: A Boy and His Lockpick
    Curse of the Azure Bonds Spring 1989
    Sword of Aragon
    Sleeping Gods Lie September 1989
    Knights of Legend October 1989
    Space Rogue October 1989
    Hero's Quest: So You Want To Be A Hero October 1989
    Starflight 2: Trade Routes of the Cloud Nebula
    Chaos Strikes Back 6-15 November 1989
    Dragon Wars 28 November 1989
    The Dark Heart of Uukrul
    Sword of Twilight
    Drakkhen

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  64. Wow, thanks! That really helps a lot.

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  65. Forgot to mention it, but Castle of the Winds is not a 1989 game (Wikipedia is wrong). It was begun in 1989 (and thus the first copyright date is from that year) but wasn't released untill 1992. I remember it was a Windows 3.1 game and I played it on my brother's 386, since I was still attached to my Amiga.

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  66. PetrusOctavianus / CRPG Addict:

    For what it's worth, MobyGames lists Castle of the Winds as being released in 1993.

    My memory is that I was an active consumer of shareware (via dial-up BBSes) since around 1990, and I didn't come across CotW until around '92-93. I'll avoid blabbering in any more detail until it gets its own article on this blog :)

    BTW, I can probably assist in getting Win 3.1 to run in DOSBox if needed.

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  67. For more about Castle of the Winds read this: http://gonnagan.wordpress.com/2011/04/23/castle-of-the-winds/

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  68. Wait, other people PLAYED CotW? o.0 That was the first computer game I remember playing on my own. I found it really tough at the time, but when I went back as an adult I breezed through both it and the sequel.
    Rick Saada, the creator will respond to email you send him. There are also several fan rewtites in progress, but they make the classic mistake of trying to clone the original exactly, which I've always found a bit silly- Why bother to rewrite it then?

    Anyway, it is one of the few games I can think of to this day to make really good use of a multi-window interface. No having to close your belt to get into your backpack, or whatever.

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  69. Petrus:

    Interesting read, thanks.


    Canageek:

    I trolled BBSes in the early-to-mid '90s, gathering any shareware games that caught my interest (I still have a box full of shareware-laden 5.25" floppies that I need to go through in case there are any more rare gems like Vampyr and Dungeon Explorer, which I uploaded to Home of the Underdogs many years ago). CotW caught my interest because I was already a fan of roguelikes (I cut my teeth on UMoria and later produced the 32-bit DOS port, which I believe is still the latest official one).

    Mordor: The Depths of Dejenol also makes extensive use of the Windows 3.x multiple child window paradigm. It came a lot later than CotW, though, in 1995. I see Dejenol is on CRPG Addict's list too.

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  70. HunterZ: Actually I was the one to mention the windows. Don't even seen a Mordor around. Cool. Not to self, Kidnap CRPGAddict, lock him in basement with only a laptop and TOR-based internet connection. Make him play RPGs if he wants to eat until he reaches 1995.

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  71. Sorry, I should have put quotes around the game name: "Mordor: The Depths of Dejenol"

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  72. Thanks for the updates, guys. I just moved COTW to 1992 and COTW: Lifthransir's Bane to 1993.

    Canageek, your plan sounds like a good one. E-mail me for my home address. A kidnapping would make my employers very forgiving about missing deadlines.

    ReplyDelete
  73. I see that you are close to Bloodwych. Be CAREFUL. That game, in the DOS version, has an unskippable bug that block your progress if you made a custom party. The only way to be able to finish it in DOS is to choose the QuickStart option, that give you a default party.

    ReplyDelete
  74. Thanks for the heads-up! Don't hesitate to remind me again if you see me doing otherwise when I get to it.

    ReplyDelete
  75. I just found your blog, and I'm looking forward to the progress. I wish someone would do the Apple II/GS games as well since I grew up with those and DOS. I'm looking through your list now and noticed Lineage: the Blood Pledge is there. This is an MMORPG with no single-player game to speak of. Uplink: Hacker Elite isn't an RPG, it's more a simulation, but a fun game. Fallout II and Fallout 2 are the same game, one is the re-release. Keep up the good work.

    ReplyDelete
  76. Just found this today. You sir, are a maniac. I sort of wanted to do something like this but had no idea there were so many CRPGs. I probably would have to stick to titles with better than average reviews in the essence of time and patience. I have tried to replay older games but the days of mapping on graph paper are over for me. I have played and enjoyed a lot of the games you have played so far. I think the gold box SSI games are likely my favorites, along with Ultima IV and V.

    Anyhow, a few comments on the list. I don't know what attributes you use to classify games as RPGs but I think a few can be safely removed. The Heroes of Might and Magic series are turn-based strategy games. Shannara is an adventure game that follows the basic story in the book. There are a LOT of games like this so you'll likely have a much bigger list if you include adventures. Typically I feel RPGs are games where character development is a core function. Adventure games (including the classics like Zork) would qualify here as well. Just my opinion.

    I am looking forward for when you get to some of my old favorites like Curse of the Azure Bonds, Might and Magic 4/5 (play them together as World of Xeen) and one of the lesser known ones called Knights of Legend. That thing is extremely tactical and I'll be curious to see what you think of it. I never finished it.

    Good luck and thanks for blogging your adventures!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Lance, check out #1 in "the rules" (right-hand column) to see how I came up with the list. On the Heroes games, I think you're probably right, but I'd like to check them out anyway because of their ties to the regular M&M franchise.

      Delete
    2. Oh, and welcome to the blog! Glad to have you as a reader.

      Delete
    3. You hated the SF elements, right? You'll probably like the first three games plot then.

      They almost added in references to the main story-line in the 3rd games expansion pack, but fan reaction was so bad they had to redo the whole thing at the last moment, reusing any units they could, thus an elemental town, since elementals were already coded in, but not usable by the player.

      I wonder if this had anything to do with how horrible the 4th game was supposed to be? The 5th game is just painful as well, not sure why, it returned very closely to the 3rd games formula, but with worse cutscenes. (Strategy game + in engine cut scenes; I'll take the text boxes, thanks)

      I own King's Bounty, I-III, with expansion packs, on CD, IV with no expansion packs on CD (never played), and V on steam; Let me know if you need to borrow any of them when the time comes.

      Delete
    4. Thanks, man. No, I didn't HATE the SF elements; I just found them a little nonsensical. It's part of the mythology of the series, though, so I have to deal with it no matter what. If I recall correctly, every one of the games has a SF ending.

      Delete
    5. Ah, well they are not in the HOMMM games.

      Delete
    6. Ah yes, thanks. I came across your guidelines after I poked around some more. I agree with most of your rules, thanks!

      Delete
  77. Another new reader here. I think I've played most of the listed games. :/

    I've always had an eccentric taste in RPGs. Am looking forward to seeing what you think about games such as Dragonflight. It's no Ultima IV, but it does break some early CRPG tropes. Declining world that was once protected by benevolent dragons...but evil won and nobody has seen a dragon in ages, magic has been forgotten and lands are dying. Instead of going forth to kill a "big bad", you're sent to search the old ruins for any magic knowledge that might remain, so it could be retaught.
    I can't think of any other game with a similar premise.

    Although...you might have to skip that one. Atari ST and Amiga versions are easily available, but the PC version is almost impossible to find - and I can't even find the English version of the manual online: http://thalion.exotica.org.uk/games/dragonflight/df.html

    Ah well. There are plenty of other games that I'm looking forward to. Thanks for the blog, it's been a good read so far.

    ReplyDelete
  78. Reading about Oubliette reminded me...
    Liberal Crime Squad is based on it, and not yet listed. Political freeware RPG/roguelike. I think it was originally released around 2002 but the latest version was released in 2011.

    Another one that's missing from the list: Elona (2008). It's a weird japanese roguelike with anime graphics. If you ever get that far, I suggest rolling a faery pianist as your first character.

    ReplyDelete
  79. Another one - Academagia: The Making of Mages (2010).
    http://www.academagia.com/

    It's a life sim/RPG set at a Hogwarts style of school. You play the role of a young wizard by choosing his daily schedule. Very complicated game with hundreds of skills, thousands of items, over hundred adventures and 800 random events, and eighty students who you can choose to befriend into your clique ("group").

    It's not a traditional CRPG (there's very little combat and not much freedom of movement), but to me it feels more like one than many other modern games. Highly recommended.

    ReplyDelete
  80. Hello, Mr. Addict.

    After admiring through your work so far, came to mind one title that had somehow evaded (or has it been left out with purpose?)

    Game is Alter Ego from 1986

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alter_Ego_%281986_video_game%29

    It is roleplaying game in sense you literally create your own character, you've free to do life choices and according to them your abilities or resources grow. Lacks a combat though and main quest's just to live until die, but can't have it all.

    If you play intended six hours, you'll get through it probably couple times.

    Save if for time when doesn't feel like taking on any longer game. :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Alter Ego is interactive fiction. It was marketed as a life simulator, and the closest thing he has on his list is the Girlfriend Construction Set. So if he found that interesting, then maybe he should check out Alter Ego.

      There are two versions for Alter Ego (Male and Female). I used to play this quite a bit when I was younger. It's a fun distraction, but I wouldn't recommend it as a computer role-playing game. It has very little to do with CRPGs.

      Delete
    2. It sounds interesting. Where it's so short, perhaps I'll give it a try in between games. The only reason it didn't appear on the list in the first place is that it's not on Wikipedia's chronology of CRPGs, and MobyGames didn't tag it as an RPG.

      Delete
  81. Hey there addict, did I miss you playing Alternate Reality: The Dungeon? Just curious how you may have liked it. Compared against other games at the time and others since, it's more of a cult classic but it was fun if you played The City and wanted more of a story and plot.

    Thanks!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It never got a DOS port, so I didn't play it. I might check it out in between games one of these days.

      Delete
    2. Oh crap, that's right. I am a bit spoiled since I played so many of these games on their native 8 bit systems. Sorry!

      Delete
  82. Oh I meant to mention that I about to see if I have the patience to play Bard's Tale II on the iPad. Getting The Bard's Tale version originally on the XBOX will get you all three of the classics. So, what the heck? I missed these somehow. Was probably too engrossed in Ultima at the time.

    ReplyDelete
  83. Is Bard's Tale really available on XBOX or do you mean this (http://www.gamespot.com/the-bards-tale-2004/) which is completely different game.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. That version is now on iOS and if you purchase it you get the original trilogy as well. So no, the originals are not on the XBOX to my knowledge. I am currently playing through BT2 on the iPad. I can't tell what version of the games they are since I didn't play them when they were originally released.

      Delete
  84. I looked up some of the games I didn't recognize.
    Dragon Knight series is Japanese, there's no English port except for part three which was called 'Knights of Xentar' in the West. It's already listed. You can probably remove Dragon Knight I-VI from the list...unless you can read Japanese?

    BTW, Knights of Xentar is a hentai RPG..

    Oh, that reminds me. Grandia II isn't listed yet. It's a console-style RPG, originally for Dreamcast but was later ported to PC in 2002. That version didn't sell well and it's hard to find nowadays.
    Grandia I and III weren't ported.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. You can't just suggest games to him: They have to be on the wikipedia list.
      You know, the one anyone can edit. *hinthintmakesuretociteapropersourcehinthint*

      Also: We get to watch him play a hentai RPG? I'm guessing that one isn't for a while, but damn, that should be fun.

      Delete
    2. I'm warning you: I don't want my blog flagged as NSFW. I'll probably block out the naughty bits.

      Zaltys, Grandia II is indeed on the list. Thanks for your comments about the other games. I imagine I'll be dumping a host of the ones on the list once I determine there's no English version. I had to be exclusive that way, but I wasn't even willing to fight through a French CRPG, and that's a language I sort-of know.

      Delete
  85. haha this is awesome! I see you are a fan of roguelikes! Hvae you played Angband yet?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I wouldn't call myself a "fan," but there are plenty of them on my list. No, Angband remains in the future.

      Delete
  86. Hey Addict, just saw your interview in Game Informer. Pretty cool to see, I just came across it while flipping through it. Did they contact/find you themselves?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes, the interviewer stumbled on my blog and decided to e-mail me. They gave me a free digital subscription. Good magazine.

      Delete
  87. I just looked through your list, and I saw that Fallout: New Vegas from 2010 wasn't listed. Fallout 3 is on there, so I believe New Vegas should have a place on the list as well.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Point 1: The list is only current through 2002. :)

      Delete
    2. I don't think CRPG Addict has updated his list very much. I mean it doesn't even have Skyrim, which he's played.

      Delete
    3. The list is there for CRPG Addict to know what is to be reviewed. Yes, he's played Skyrim, but hasn't reviewed it with the GIMLET scale and all that. It'll take decades for him to get that far...

      Delete
  88. You're missing out on A LOT of great stuff, tho.

    There are some great RPGs that run on the Amiga and are absolutely perfect in a emulator. For example Captive and Black Crypt.

    Amberstar and the big sequel Ambermoon are also must play. Amberstar is on your list because it was ported to DOS, but Ambermoon is the much better game and only exists on the Amiga. You can't miss that one.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Limiting anything is going to cause some good things to be left behind. Without a focus though, he'd be lost in old games for at least another decade. If your next suggestion is just to play those games, then you're missing that half the fun of this project is learning about the unknown games.

      Delete
  89. Should Neuromancer be considered as RPG or is it purely Adventure? All the sources call it adventure and it looks like adventure. But it also had skill / software based combat which reminds of JRPG, some stats and stuff you'd find in light rpg.

    It also has Fargo and Stackpole as designers and you could sell your lungs for cash in it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I looked at the MobyGames and Wikipedia descriptions and couldn't reach a strong conclusion. Any other players of this one that have an opinion?

      Delete
    2. I'd be interested in you giving it six hours, since it is based on a popular book (though one I don't like) and has some big names behind it. We could ask Bryan Fargo if he would call it an RPG, since he is on twitter. Actually, so is Micheal Stackpole.

      Delete
    3. Got an answer:

      From: Michael A Stackpole ‏(@MikeStackpole )

      "@Canageek @BrianFargo Definitely an RPG.... in a very cyberpunk way."

      -- https://twitter.com/#!/MikeStackpole/status/202567021257424899

      Does that work for you, Chet?

      Delete
    4. I don't really know what it means, but I'll check it out. You realize you're adding yet another game to 1988, right? I'm never going to get out of this bloody year.

      Delete
    5. Begging for forgivance here, but no fear ridding '88 as Neuromancer's DOS version was released according to Mobygames in 1989 and C64 version in 1988.

      Speaking of 1989 Accolade's Third Courier was published then. Though for some reason it is categorized as action game in Mobygames, but it is somewhat variation of Bard's Tale. Ain't any good though, but genre being Cold War-era espionage makes it interesting curiosity.

      Delete
    6. I play in the year that it was released on its original platform, alas.

      Delete
  90. I peeked at your master gamelist and got question regarding goldbox games that if you're going to import parties from previous ones or are you creating new parties for each game. Regarding gaming order I'd remember that COAB accepts characters from POR and Hillsfar, but SOSB only from COAB.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's likely that I'll create new characters for CotAB. My recollection is that the second game features more classes and doesn't have such penalizing level caps; my multi-classed POR party was mostly to avoid the latter.

      Delete
  91. Looks like you have a lot of games that are not RPG's most are noted that Tom G. said they were not, and I want to reaffirm this. I've played almost all of them



    Romance of 3 Kingdoms (all are the same pretty much) - To put it simply... Think Defender of the Crown (awesome game), set in China with a thousand more options. Char's (generals, advisers etc..) have statistics and they may even change with time, but there are no real quests involved and no real inventory. (I think you can give your generals a weapon that increases their combat stat) You simply conquer territory with your armies, train your army, and make sure the land is fertile enough to feed all of the population. This may be the CLOSEST to a CRPG from the ones I am listing, but the contrasts to a real CRPG will quickly stand out if you load it up.

    Gemfire- Same as Romance but with a Fantasy twist and cheaper, more shallow gameplay.

    Uncharted Waters is, I guess, as much a CRPG as Pirates! but the port I played on Super Nintendo was not nearly as much fun/diverse and focused more on economy than battle. I don't think you really have stats like str or int.

    G. Khan is pretty much a clone of Romance.

    Great games on their own terms, but I don't think you will want to keep them on your list as I believe they all violate at least 2 of your 3 main req's for CRPG's

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Duly noted. Since SOMEONE thought they were CRPGs, I at least want to have a look at them when the time comes. But I've got your comments for support when I decide to dump them.

      Delete
  92. One more thing.
    Any way you might consider adding your review score to the list?

    ReplyDelete
  93. PetrusOctavianusJune 17, 2012 at 5:24 PM

    The Ultizurk games are missing from your list. Very obscure games, but sounds like something a real CRPG Addict would enjoy: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/ultizurk-an-extremely-obscure-long-lost-ultima-clone-series-from-the-90s.71952/

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Oh, Petrus. You've just thrown my world in disarray. MobyGames has NOTHING on these. I thought their database was comprehensive. Now I have to obsess about how many other games I'm missing!

      I'm having trouble nailing down a year for these. Even the developer's own web site doesn't have it.

      Delete
    2. According to IGN, Ultizurk 3 was released on January 1st, 1970. I guess it ran on a PDP-1. What did the first one run on? An abacus? Hahahaha!

      Delete
    3. Sorry to disappoint you folks... documenting the Ultizurk games on MobyGames has been on my to-do list for quite some time but before I can document them I need to find time to /play/ them, making them somewhat low-priority, alas. Anything else I could think of to add to the list I already have, in the form of documenting them on MobyGames first 8)

      Delete
    4. Oh dang. Ultizurk. That is a name I do not remember hearing since rec.games.computer.role-playing or whatever, haha. Along with UltiMUHHH, that was recommended to me when I asked about other games like Ultima VI (though obviously UltiMUHH was a joke recommendation and is a parody side-scroller, albeit a slightly funny parody side-scroller). Good times, back when even the Internet was not necessarily that useful for exhaustively finding things.

      Delete
  94. PetrusOctavianusJune 18, 2012 at 6:29 AM

    Heh, there is a reason these games are considered "extremely obscure". And Moby Games actually miss some of the old ZX Spectrum games I used to play as a kid.
    Anyway, I guess you could download the games and look at the dates of the actual game files to determine which year they were released. I checked the first Ultizurk game and the oldest files are dated March 1992, which incidentally is when the groundbreaking Ultima Underworld was released. Or you could ask the designer himself. His nic on the Codex is DrDungeon.

    Amy, I don't trust sites like IGN or GiantBomb. They often list some random release date just to make their info seem complete.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. You think the file dates are indicative of the original release date? I guess if that's all I have to go by. All right, I've added it to my list for 1992.

      Delete
  95. Dragon Knight is coming up in 1989, yes? Two things you should probably know about it: One, it's a japanese game that, to my knowledge, was never released in the U.S.. Dragon Knight III came over as Knights of Xentar, but the previous/later games are only legally available as imports.

    The second thing is that it's a porn game. It says as much on mobygames' description, though the screenshots don't go into detail. I haven't played it, so I don't know how far it goes. I have played Knights of Xentar, and I can vouch for that game being at least worth a try. Yes, there are quite a few nudie pics, but the tone is more bawdy than titillating, and it's got humorous writing and a unique combat system to its credit.

    Actually, taking a brief look over your list, I note a few other porn RPGs there. Cobra Mission, Mad Paradox, True Love (which may or may not be an RPG, depending on your interpretation of the term). Are you okay with covering stuff like that?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. That's fairly amusing. I had no idea. I guess I'll deal with them on a case-by-case basis as I get to them.

      I might indeed skip Dragon Knight. I'm not sure how it ended up on my list, as it doesn't have a DOS or PC release.

      Delete
    2. Someone somewhere probably confused "PC-98" with "PC". The PC-98 was a Japanese computer from the 80's which was more or less to Japan what the Commodore 64 was to America or the Spectrum ZX to the UK. I understand that there were a lot of good games for it, but like virtually all machines of the era, they more or less died out in the 90s due to hardware advancements and the rise of MS-DOS and Windows.

      Delete
    3. Hmm, I may have to write up a Monster Girl Quest wikipedia article, so I can add it to the Wikipedia list and force you to play it.

      ...that should make your blog NSFW in record time.

      Delete
    4. "Someone" was probably me, since I compiled the list. I wonder if I did that with any other games. I guess I'll find out as I get to them.

      Delete
    5. You did, I sent you a long email a few months ago, about 200 games you could cut and categorized them. Sorry if I overwhelmed you and you ignored it. Let me know if you want me to send it again.

      Delete
    6. So many readers have sent me games they think I should cut from my list that I'm not blithely taking anyone's word for it. Instead, I've been taking notes on the objections and planning to deal with them when I get to them.

      That said, I'll be damned if I can find that list. Did I reply to you when you sent it? Either way, yes, I'd greatly appreciate if you could re-send.

      Delete
    7. hmmm, I know I sent it, and you replied, but I can't find it for the life of me. I may have trashed the conversation by mistake.

      Delete
    8. Did you dream it Zenic? ;)

      Delete
    9. It was a very vivid dream if I did. ;)

      Delete
  96. Oh man, you HAD to warn him about the porn games, didn't you? I want the see the Addict go into one of those without knowing what it is. :D

    ReplyDelete
  97. Have anyone mentioned Omnitrend's Universe-series? Probably not pure RPGs, but Universe III's interface certainly reminiscents Ultima-style top-down look. (http://www.mobygames.com/game/universe-3), Universe II sounds like RPG (http://www.mobygames.com/game/universe-ii). Universe 1 seems more concentrated on trading.

    Also, Accolade's The Third Courier probably might be adequate candidate for list. (http://www.mobygames.com/game/third-courier). Don't know why Mobygames has categorized it as Action, but having a look at screenshots is more revealing.

    Ubisoft's Iron Lord (http://www.mobygames.com/game/iron-lord) might not be RPG, but if you're going to play Hillsfar might as well try that out. I'd remember it being somewhat similar.

    One more questionable would be Bad Blood which is essentially Times of Lore in Wasteland. (http://www.mobygames.com/game/bad-blood)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This might also be called RPGs, though light and action-oriented:

      Boiling Point: Road to Hell (http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/boiling-point-road-to-hell)

      Xenus II: White Gold (http://www.mobygames.com/game/xenus-ii-white-gold)

      Precursors (http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/precursors)

      Delete
    2. Checking Steam's RPGs vs. Master List minus MMORPGs. Lots of questionable stuff which RPG qualities could be argued but someone had decided to categorize so.

      And publishing dates are naturally for Steam, so original years need to be checked... in time.

      2006
      Sid Meier's Pirates!
      The Ship - Single Player
      Dreamfall: Longest Journey

      2007
      Longest Journey
      UFO: Afterlight
      Vigil: Blood Bitterness
      Spaceforce: Rogue Universe
      Bioshock
      STALKER: Shadow of Chernobyl

      2008
      Precipice of Darkness, Episode One
      STALKER: Clear Sky
      Geneforge 5: Overthrow
      Mount & Blade
      Precipice of Darkness, Episode Two

      2009
      Rise of the Argonauts
      Dangerous High School Girls In Trouble!
      Two Worlds - Epic Edition
      Borderlands
      Spellforce - Platinum Edition
      Spellforce 2 - Gold Edition
      Aztaka
      Zombie Shooter 2
      King's Bounty: Armored Princess
      King Arthur: Roleplaying Wargame
      Gothic 3
      Sherlock Holmes vs. Jack The Ripper

      2010
      Star Wolves 2
      Star Wolves 3: Civil War
      Space Rangers 2: Reboot
      Mount & Blade: Warband
      Puzzle Chronicles
      Alpha Protocol
      Disciples III: Renaissance
      Puzzle Quest 2
      Receatter: An Item Shop's Tale
      King's Bounty: Crossworlds
      Delve Deeper
      Age of Wonders II: Wizard's Throne
      Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
      Arcania
      Grotesque Tactics: Evil Heroes
      Fallout: New Vegas
      Patrician III
      DeathSpank: Thongs of Virtue

      2011
      Magicka
      Landstalker: Treasures of King Nole
      Light Crusader
      Shining in the Darkness
      Shining Force II
      Shining Force
      Two Worlds II
      DUNGEONS
      Darkspore
      Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
      Terraria
      Fable III
      Dungeon Siege III
      Dungeons & Dragons: Daggerdale
      Dungeons of Dredmor
      Cthulhu Saves The World
      Breath of Death VII
      Runespell: Overture
      Chantelise: A Tale of Two Sisters
      E.Y.E.: A Divine Cybermancy
      Space Pirates and Zombies
      Bastion
      Avadon: The Black Fortress
      Deus Ex: Human Revolution
      The Baconing
      Dead Island
      King Arthur: Fallen Champions
      Might & Magic: Clash of Heroes
      Dungeons: The Dark Lord
      Binding of Isaac
      Costume Quest
      Dungeon Defenders
      Sequence
      Serious Sam: The Random Encounter
      ArcaniA: Fall of Setarrif
      Lord of the Rings: War in the North
      Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim
      Grotesque Tactics 2: Dungeons & Donuts
      Demigod

      2012
      King Arthur II: Roleplaying Wargame
      Fortune Summoners
      Magic: The Gathering - Tactics
      Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning
      Jagged Alliance: Back In Action
      Starpoint Gemini
      All Zombie Must Die!
      Ys: The Oath in Felghana
      Confrontation
      Hack, Slash, Loot
      Shoot Many Robots
      Avernum: Escape From The Pit
      Legend of Grimrock
      Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings
      Lone Survivor
      Risen 2: Dark Waters
      Avernum 6
      Game of Thrones
      Magical Diary
      Ys Origin
      Krater
      Spellforce 2: Faith in Destiny
      Penny Arcade's On The Rain-Slick: Precipice of Darkness 3

      Delete
    3. Too many anons here. I don't know if you're all the same person or what.

      Last two: I appreciate all the effort, but I haven't even looked at MobyGames's lists for beyond 2003 yet, so it's possible I'd have a lot of those if I took the time to do the update. I guess I should do that so I stop confusing people.

      First: I read all the descriptions and I can see why you say they "might be" RPGs, but there wasn't enough to convince me, especially where no one has specifically classified them that way. I'd need to hear from someone that's played them and can report that they meet 2 of my three core criteria.

      Delete
    4. Random EncounterJuly 1, 2012 at 8:16 AM

      For the first listing - all of them are categorized as RPGs in Home of the Underdogs (including Roadwar 2000 / Europa which were briefly mentioned in Auto Duel's post.)

      Exception is Third Courier which was ranked as Adventure. But then again, searching the Gamespot says it is RPG..

      (Site also contains formidable list, which might contain games other sources missed:
      http://www.gamespot.com/games.html?platform=5&category=Role-Playing&mode=all&sort=release&dlx_type=all&sortdir=desc&official=all&page=0)

      ...and it is also mentioned on list that Jan linked. Go figure.

      Delete
    5. Ugh. Can't someone just make ONE damned authoritative, all-inclusive list out there?

      Delete
    6. Yeah. You can. (tee hee)

      Delete
    7. Random EncounterJuly 2, 2012 at 3:37 PM

      Well, Amy just took foot off my mouth. Your master game list will be the one you're seeking.

      Delete
    8. You seem to be doing an EXCELLENT job.

      Delete
    9. I stayed up all night last night. I THINK I finally have it.

      Delete
    10. Until someone else has a smart idea, like going though Steam's entire catalogue.

      Delete
  98. GOG vs. Master List

    1993
    Robinson's Requiem Collection

    2004
    Warlords Battlecry 3

    2006
    Spellforce 2: Shadow Wars

    2007
    Spellforce 2: Dragon Storm

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks. Yet another source I should probably check! I've added them.

      Delete
  99. Great blog. I am a CRPG enthusiast too and I played many, many old DOS RPGs but completed only few. I really enjoy reading about your gaming sessions.

    Some suggestions for your master game list:
    - Gene Splicing is a nice looking SciFi RPG for DOS from 1996, published as freeware in 1999. It's website is still online: http://genesplicing.astrodragon.com/

    - Motelsoft has several DOS CRPGs still for sale (Ragor, Darkside of the Sun) that are not on your list. I played the Ragor games (and completed them AFAIR) but these are really bad, in German and definitely not worth the 20€ they are asking for the collection. You have been warned :). Their website: http://www.motelsoft.de/motelsoftfeng.html

    - There is an old website that was active from 1996 to 2002 with a comprehensive list of CRPGs. Have a look and you might find some other obscure games at http://www.crpg.de/crpg.htm#a-z

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I just saw that you don't have to pay for the Motelsoft games anymore. There are downloads available. Doesn't make these games any better though.

      Delete
    2. Thank you for the additions. Unfortunately, you and a few others have destroyed my faith in Mobygames's infallibility. I wonder why they don't list any of these titles.

      Delete
    3. Mobygames doesn't like incomplete listings, so you're never going to see a game without the basic information (release date, developer, publisher, regions, system, and how it was packaged). If any of these are missing or unknown, then it doesn't get added even if someone provides other information.

      I've tried adding obscure games in the past, but when they're so obscure that the best you have is a release range of 83 - 87, it's just not going to cut it for them.

      Also, they rely strictly on user submissions. In the past they were notorious for taking up to a year to verify and list games, which caused many people to just stop posting and researching.

      I've also mentioned this in the past, but you can submit a correction for a game that's obviously not an RPG with a valid reason and the genre will be removed (lately within two months). I'm sure if you did this with games like the Middle Earth one that caused you to come up with some rules, then it'd get taken down and vindicate you.

      Delete
  100. I just ran across a site that you should check out: The Museum of Computer Adventure Game History. Despite what the name implies, it seems to include RPGs and Adventure games.

    I found it while looks for scanned maps of Star Saga, as the kit that comes with the game hasn't been much use aside from providing just the map.

    ReplyDelete
  101. From the latest comments, it looks like I need to go completely back to the drawing board, visit a bunch of different sites, and recreate my list (at least from this point onward). Man, I had no idea it would be this tough, but if I'd thought about it, I guess I would have realized that there's no scientific definition of a CRPG. Everyone's going to have a slightly different list.

    ReplyDelete
  102. PetrusOctavianusJuly 2, 2012 at 7:07 PM

    Too bad I didn't find this blog until about "1987" or I would have pimped the 1984 game Lords of Midnight (DOS versions were made about 15 years after release) and insisted it contains enough CRPG elements to be included on the list.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yeah, I have it on my list for 1995. God, keeping this stuff all straight is a nightmare.

      Delete
    2. PetrusOctavianusJuly 3, 2012 at 3:39 PM

      1995? That must be the real time clusterfusk that was Lords of Midnight III: The Citadel. I'm talking about the turn based fantasy strategy wargame with CRPG elements from 1984:
      http://www.mobygames.com/game/lords-of-midnight_
      I guess it was not on your list since MobyGames does not list a DOS version, even though one was made years later. Seems Moby only list commercial games.
      If you want to add it to the list I recommend the remake - The Midnight Engine - from 1999, since it has an automap. You can download it, as well as the original DOS version, here: http://www.icemark.com/downloads/index.html

      Delete
    3. MobyGames doesn't only list commercial games; however, that's the majority of games that have been added by the community. This is evidenced by their listing of browser based games.

      The moderators of MobyGames are a very small group, don't actively seek out to fill their database. They rely solely on active community members to submit content, which doesn't get posted unless verified through "reliable" sources.

      Delete
    4. I can't fault them for that. I can't imagine all the nonsense that would be in the database if they just accepted submissions from anyone on anything.

      I've noticed that almost all of their games have screenshots, so I'm guessing you need to submit proof that it exists via screenshots for them to accept.

      Delete
  103. I know that current games are a long ways off, but you should consider FTL: Faster Than List from GOG.com or Steam.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I already lost a few nights sleep because I couldn't stop playing.

      I had a friend over and we were talking games and decided to check if FTL was released yet and it just happened to be released the same day. So I grabbed the version for Linux and didn't get to sleep till after 6AM.

      Delete
    2. Whoops, that should be "FTL: Faster Than Light". Guess I got a little excited.

      Delete
    3. I was only up until 3 am the first night.

      I've beaten the first form of the Flagship once, but had already used up all the repair points and died to a mook before fighting his second form.

      Delete
    4. We got to the Flagship and beat his first form on normal the first night, but I have not been able to further since. I even tried on easy which made money more available but I couldn't beat his second form. I will probably try again after work.

      I wish I knew what I needed to do to unlock things though. It is not readily clear in-game and nothing in the manual.

      Delete
    5. It shows on the hangar screen what you need to do to unlock the alternate layouts for the ship(s) you currently have access to, but as far as I know it doesn't show what you need to do to unlock the alternate ships.

      I unlocked the Engi one by chance. It made the game easier, but I still couldn't beat the last phase or two of the flagship on easy.

      Delete
    6. I saw that on the hangar screen, but I want to view my achievements and see what others are available as well as what needs to be done to unlock them. I figure many of these things will be addressed in a patch as we are playing at release.

      My friend unlocked the Engi ship in a rock controlled sector but we don't know if the sector was relevant or what else caused the achievement to trigger.

      If I get a slow point at work I may search the inter-tubes for answers.

      Delete
    7. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Ships

      Says how to unlock the ships.

      Why is it not 5PM yet?

      Delete
  104. You have list your MasterGameList the Game 4/16/1992 Amberstar.
    The Sequel Ambermoon 12/1993 is missing. There are only a Amiga version. Pls break the rule.

    The unofficial sequel Albion is also in the list.


    An other good crpg for Amiga is
    Fate: Gates of Dawn (1992)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ah, Ambermoon. I've managed to download an English-speaking version myself, but I've been unable to get it working in WinUAE. Most frustrating.

      Delete
    2. Here is an install tutorial
      http://www.dilac.de/amber/ambermoon/install.html

      It's in german but you can use google-translator. I tried this tutorial. It works.
      It is with an HDD installation.

      Delete
    3. Thanks, Marius. I did install the game with some instructions in German. That was probably the one.

      Delete

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