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The things this blog makes me spend my time on.
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I appreciate all the comments--the most on a single entry in a long time--on my first Betrayal at Krondor entry. It sounds like this game is part of a long lineage of CRPGs that insists urgency in the main quest while simultaneously offering lots of side areas and side quests, creating something of a conflict between role-playing and character development. In many past games, I have sometimes enjoyed finding ways to justify dillydallying on what seems like an emergency. For instance, in Baldur's Gate II, where I usually played a paladin, I justified not going to the Thieves Guild as soon as I had 20,000 gold to spend by saying that I had to exhaust every other option before resorting to working with thieves. (My paladin, incidentally, had sworn an oath never to be part of any
military. That's why he only travels with six companions max; anything
more starts to feel like a military unit.) In Oblivion, I would pretend that Martin had begged me not to take him to Cloud Ruler Temple as an excuse to spend hours adventuring together (at some point, he'd realize he had to do his duty). Fallout 4 is a tough one.
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I don't know. Seems like the kid is in good hands.
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"We need to get stronger before we take on [the big bad]" is an easy, if somewhat unimaginative, excuse. What retcons, surplaying, and twists of logic have you used to justify dillydallying?
The problem here in Krondor is that the game world is quite large--at least, it seems to me at the outset--and so I'm not sure I can justify taking the time to loop around every city in every chapter just to see what new side quests await. On the other hand, I don't insist on seeing absolutely everything that a game has to offer, so perhaps it will be enough to do just a little ancillary exploration. I can justify it here because we're being stalked by assassins, and taking the direct route to Krondor is too obvious.
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I'd say we're taking the long way around.
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This session begins with my three characters--Locklear, Owyn, and Gorath--on the road between Yabon and Zun. Locklear and Gorath are bringing word to Krondor about some new devilry with the Moredhel (dark elves), and Owyn is a local boy they swept up in the journey. We've already killed two Moredhel assassins.
As I start this session, I'm a bit curious about how physical space works in the game. The map shows roads, structures, and hills, and it makes it look like the hills are obstacles that can't be crossed. You don't seem to be able to walk up to them in the game, unlike the later Might and Magic VI, but let me know if I'm wrong. If I'm not wrong, the hills create confined corridors and spaces in which you can explore. I suspect if you just stick to the road, you'll miss things off to the sides.
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Hills create borders and define the explorable area.
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In this spirit, we start moving back and forth across the road and around hills (remember, we're trying to create false trails for assassins) to see if we find anything. We don't find anything material, but on the other side of a hill, we find a small graveyard with about half a dozen headstones:
- Mirriam Haselcalph: "To the drawer of nets she took her key."
- A. R. Cramond. "He told a lie and paid the price."
- Jad Peebles. "He engaged in his last undertaking."
- Rosel LaMutian: "Her face was sweet and her hands could heal."
- Hyden Miller. "A bone did him in."
- Pargus Attacarper. "His fish didn't get away."
- Michel Ambazac: "As you are, I once was. As I am, you will be."
- Goldie Crowe. "In death her face was that of a sovereign."
These seem honest attempts at world-building rather than in-jokes. The "Drawer of Nets" is a name for Lims-Kragma, the goddess of death. "LaMutian" indicates that she came from the nearby city of LaMut. There's a character in Darkness at Sethanon named Morgan Crowe, but I don't know if there's a relationship with Goldie. I believe he was from this area.
As I inspect each of the headstones, Owyn asks Locklear whether we should dig up the grave. I say no each time.
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No. And it's really weird that you keep asking.
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By this time, we've come pretty close to the city of LaMut. In the books, the city is part of the Duchy of Yabon. A Tsurani general named Kasumi, trapped in Midkemia after the destruction of the rift at the end of Magician, swore allegiance to King Lyam and became the Earl of LaMut. Pug re-established a permanent rift at the end of Sethanon (and negotiated a peace between the worlds), but Kasumi and most of his men chose to stay in MidKemia. As he was one of my favorite characters in the books, I decide to pop over to the city and see if we get to meet him in-game.
The game surprises me as we near the city. Although it appears on the map as individual houses, the player apparently can't explore cities (at least, not this one) like the rest of the map. Instead, the game automatically moves the party into the city and it becomes a menu city with a title card. Hovering the cursor over the buildings gives us options to visit the shop, the inn, and the garrison.
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We can visit the governor, visit a tavern, trade with a merchant, or divide up the plunder.
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The shop, called Fletcher's Post, buys, sells, and theoretically repairs weapons and armor. I say "theoretically" because when the shopkeeper summons his unreliable tinker, the man simply tells us that he doesn't have the skill to repair our swords and armor. (From the narrative, I think he only does crossbows.) We do end up selling our excess swords and armor to the shop. This is a good place to note that the game makes good use of the mouse in the shop interface. You simply drag an item you wish to buy to the character or an item you wish to sell to the shop.
The currency of the game consists of gold sovereigns and silver royals, and we don't have enough of either to buy anything we want. We have only 18 sovereigns when we enter. A good crossbow costs 55 and the best crossbow costs 797.
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The merchant's wares.
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The tavern is called the Blue Wheel Inn and has a few denizens. A mercenary tells us some dwarves have offered a reward for the death of a creature called "a Brock Noor or something." A dwarf named Dubal An Loch knows Locklear: "I fetched you out of a cellar along with a score o' womenfolk at the Battle of Sethanon!" (In the books, Locklear is last seen protecting the women during the battle.) He confirms that the dwarves are looking for someone to kill a Brak Nurr in the mines of Mac Mordain Cadal. (The mines play a big role in Magician in a sequence obviously drawn from Moria in The Fellowship of the Ring.)
The bartender is a Tsurani named Sumani. We get keyword dialogue options with him. He was among those warriors trapped with Kasumi at the end of the Rift War. We learn from him that the permanent rift to Kelewan is nearby, but traffic between the worlds has been halted by some political struggle in Kelewan. Sumani will train combat skills, but at a high price of 75 sovereigns. We also decline to pay 5 sovereigns to stay at the inn, since we haven't really lost any health.
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At least they got an Asian-looking guy to play the Tsurani role.
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I noted this in the first entry, but it bears repeating: this game narrates everything as if it's part of a book. When you enter the shop, you get a description of the shop. ("The Fletcher's Post had been constructed with elven sensibilities.") Click on the "Repair" option in the shop, and you get a little story about how the shopkeeper whistles for the tinker. When the tinker can't repair something, you get a little quote from him. When you go to sell something, you get a quote from the shopkeeper about the sale price. You can't even say "no" to staying at the inn at night without a little vignette about Locklear advising the innkeeper to lower his prices. This is all fun for now, but I wonder if it's going to get annoying by the end. It's important for you to understand that almost every time I tell you that we did something or something happened, it came with a couple of paragraphs of descriptive text that I'm only rarely showing or quoting.
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I actually thought the cost was quite reasonable.
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In the garrison, we meet Captain Belford. He's distressed because some grey warriors (mercenaries, basically) from Kelewan recently passed through town. They're wanted because they stole a ruby from a Tsurani Great One (magician). There's a reward if we find it.
That's about all there is to do in LaMut. The Mac Mordain Cadal quest intrigues me, but the mines are supposed to be pretty far to the west, and the game doesn't give us a choice about which way to leave LaMut. When we exit, we're back on the road to the east--in the dark. The game apparently has a day/night cycle. It cleverly makes it dark in both the game world and on the overhead map, so you can't use map navigation as an easy alternative. I try to cast "Candle Glow," but the game won't let me for some reason. I end up lighting a torch, which just makes me realize that I need more torches.
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That's one powerful torch.
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Hardly any distance down the road, we find the entrance to Mac Mordain Cadal. We choose to enter, the torch we lit outside still providing light. I don't know how long it will last, and I only have one more, so I save near the entrance.
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This reminds me so much of the later Might and Magic games that it's eerie.
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Only a few steps into the cave, a dwarf named Naddur Bank Dok makes an inept attack with a magic hammer before he realizes we're there to help. He tells us about the Brak Nurr, which I guess is a species of beast rather than one beast. This one is the first the dwarves have seen in an age; "the kobolds are stirring them up" on their quest to find their lost god, a dragon that died in Magician (an oddity of this setting is that kobolds and gnomes are the same thing). He gives us a description ("'alf again your height, and a'made of stone"). We inquire about repairs, and he says the dwarves don't have time right now, although he'll teach us to do it ourselves for 50 sovereigns (which of course we don't have).
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I guess the "bravos" he refers to here are the rogues we later encounter.
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I'm forced to camp for a few hours--apparently, you need sleep in this game even when you haven't lost any health--and of course it's dark when we awaken despite the graphics showing torches all up and down the walls. We light our second and last one and continue down the hallway. I have to say, there are aspects of movement that I don't like. The game "corrects" you a lot, usually making things worse. For instance, if you come to an intersection and clip the corner while turning, it will automatically turn the party to face the original facing direction, forcing you to move forward and turn again. Since I have a hard time judging when I've cleared a corner, I spend a lot of time fighting against the game trying to turn me in a direction I don't want.
Fortunately, you can move on the map indoors, too, which is much faster and smoother. You don't want to do it during initial exploration, as you'll miss things like chests, but it's great for the return trip.
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Moving via the map.
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While we're on the subject of movement, is there some other game in which holding down SHIFT with the arrow keys moves you faster? I keep accidentally doing that, which in this game stops you cold.
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We creep up on some rogues.
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We turn a corner and face two rogues, our second battle of the game. I try out the "Despair Thine Eyes" spell--a blinding spell discussed in the comments to the last entry--and it does seem to be effective. With Morath taking one rogue and Locklear taking the other, I'm able to kill them both before they wound me at all. I guess they might have been Moredhel, as they dropped "Moredhel Lampreys," weapons that despite a poor textual description did greater damage (though with less accuracy) than my existing broadswords. They also had armor in better condition than mine.
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This battle goes all right.
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In a huge room with nothing else in it that I can find, I find a chest. I have Owyn cast "Scent of Sarig," a trap detection spell, before we open it, and he does detect a trap. We try to disarm it, and it blows up, reducing everyone's hit points to single digits and nearly killing Owyn. Everyone takes a few restoratives, but they don't do much; fortunately, health restores (slowly) on its own as you travel. It's almost worth it: the chest has a shovel, 57 sovereigns, and 97 royals.
We're not terribly excited when we therefore encounter another chest at a T-intersection, but this one isn't trapped. It is, however, locked, and no one is able to open it. Another chest at another T-intersection is untrapped and unlocked. It has three herbal packets, which I guess speed up natural healing. I have the characters use them.
Behind a closed door, we find three more rogues. The fight does not go well. Owyn is too weakened to cast spells; I guess "near-death" is not just an assessment of hit points, but a semi-permanent condition that needs to be healed. I try camping, but Owyn's stats barely budge, and the "Camp Until Healed" option just causes us to run out of rations in a hot minute. I don't like to do this, but while I'm still feeling things out, I give myself permission to reload from after I defeated the first rogues and before I opened the disastrous chest. I try again with the same result.
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The death screen.
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Ignoring the voice telling me that I'm here too soon, I keep going. This time the locked chest opens to the lockpicks and has 78 royals.
We reach the three rogues this time in much better shape, although we're unable to surprise them. I guess you surprise enemies by clicking on them (which gives you a little narrative text) before moving forward. If you just blunder into them, they get to attack first. These guys got to attack first both times, though.
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Even the process of surprising enemies is narrated.
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I defeat them with the same strategy as I used last time. They have broadswords, standard armor, elven armor, rations, and a couple of crossbows with bolts. A locked chest in their room has another broadsword and more standard armor. I swap out my mostly-damaged broadswords for only slightly-damaged ones.
By now, I've discovered "Candle Glow" works underground, so I'm able to cast it when the torches run out. Another battle against four rogues doesn't go so well. Two of them insist on swarming Owyn, preventing him from casting spells. I replay the battle a bunch of times trying to get better at combat. Some notes:
- There's a certain realism to it in the sense that your stamina starts to flag after a few rounds, until you get to the point that you and the enemy are just exhausted, whiffing every attack. A "rest" option lets you recover a bit, but only a bit.
- Even understanding the stamina system, I can't help but feel that the game lies about accuracy. I don't hit nearly as often as the accuracy percentage would indicate.
- This is one of the few games I've played where defense really has some value. I found that if I had the beleaguered Owyn defend instead of attacking or trying to run away, he could stay alive long enough for the two fighters to finish off their foes and come to his aid.
- It's hard to imagine using crossbows. They do less damage than swords and the battlefield is so small that you really can't hold enemies at a range.
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No way do I hit 52% of the time when I thrust.
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Eventually, I get lucky and am able to kill them all, although with Owyn unconscious and the other two pretty low in both health and stamina. It takes a couple days' rest to even get back to mediocre status. In addition to weapons and armor, the rogues have a couple of whetstones, a cloth that "enhances" a blade, and about 20 sovereigns. I run out of inventory space trying to pick up all their stuff.
Meanwhile, the room has a Moredhel chest, this one with six tumblers. The riddle is: "Two legs it has, and this will confound: Only at rest do they touch the ground." The tumblers offer these potential combinations:
E T R I O S
R S W L N W
O A O H D G
B U T R T E
I wonder how possible it would be to get most of these simply by looking for valid letter combinations. Just for fun, without thinking too much of the riddle, I try it out. I used Access to give me all 4,096 valid combinations. NOT LIKE "RS*" reduced it to 3,840. Other obvious ones at the beginning and end (e.g., RT*, BT*, *TW) reduced it to 2,112. Some more technically possible but unlikely combinations had it down to 585. Within a few minutes, I had whittled it down enough that I could pick out the valid words from a list of less than 100: BARING, BARROW, BATING, BURROW, EATING, OARING, RARING, and RATING. I don't know; maybe I missed some. Anyway, the second word is the answer, but only if you're thinking about the WHEEL kind and not the mound kind. The entire exercise takes me about 10 minutes. It's possible I wouldn't have come up with the answer in 10 minutes of just thinking about it.
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As an expert in fauna, I can assure you that the legs of a rathog do not touch the ground until it rests.
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The chest offers 166 royals, two Rings of Prandur (which cast a light spell), 4 ropes, and a vial of Dalatail Milk, which is "reputed to increase one's ability to defend oneself during combat." Permanently or temporarily?
At length, we come to the room with the Brak Nurr, which looks like a kind of stone golem. I don't know if "Despair Thy Eyes" will work on it, but that's Owyn's one thing, so I cast it anyway, then surround him. He has a lot of hit points, but he doesn't manage to hit us once before we kill him.
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Give me a single tough enemy over multiple regular enemies any day.
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Naddur Ban Dok appears in the room to congratulate us and give us a pouch with about 150 gold sovereigns. Suddenly, we're rich. A locked chest in the room opens with the "peasant's key" (I don't remember where I got this) and offers a "Guilder's Passkey," 4 ropes, 3 torches, and 5 restoratives.
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First side quest solved!
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There are a few other things to discover in the mines, including a corridor that the dwarves won't let us pass, another tough battle with four rogues, a locked door that opened to one of my guilder's keys, and two more Moredhel boxes:
- "Round as an apple, deep as a cup, all the bitter sea, can't fill it up." The answer had five letters. The riddle is cute because it alludes to a different riddle whose final line is "all the king's horses can't fill it up," and the answer is WELL. Clearly an entire sea could fill a well, plus WELL is only four letters, so the answer here must be different. I don't do the Access trick again, but I still spend some time scrolling through the letters before I get it with (SIEVE). These are legitimately hard. It has a couple of broadswords (which I don't take), a shell, and a book titled Lorgan's Journal. It's by a dwarf, mentions the Brak Nurr, and also mentions a secret chamber in the lower levels ("Rhuargh's Room"), which I'm not sure how to access. Rhuargh was an ancient dragon in Magician whose magical gifts gave Tomas his power and his connection with the spirit of an ancient Valheru. He died after their encounter.
- "Although my cow is dead, I continue to beat her. What a racket she makes!" I get this one without having to look at the letters (DRUM). The chest has some money and a pair of "Weedwalkers," shoes that add 30% to stealth as long as they're in your inventory. So it turns out what I said last time about there being no special items like helms and boots, just generic suits of "armor," isn't true. You just don't equip them in the left-hand pane.
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The shoes have Gorath's stealth up to 63%.
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If there are any secret doors or secret areas on this level, or ways to lower levels, we don't find them. Eventually, we've mapped the only level we seem to be able to explore, and we head for the exit. Naddur Ban Dok stops us again on the way out, and we're able to ask him about Rhuargh's Room. He confirms the backstory and says that it's full of treasure, but thanks to the Brak Nurr collapsing passages, it's going to take them a while to dig it out. "Come back later and mayhap we'll see it together!"
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Onomatopoeia at work.
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It's dark when we emerge, and Owyn's health is down to 3, so we camp until morning and have Owyn take an herbal pack. We continue south towards Krondor, though I'm looking forward to just making it to the next city, Zun, and offloading some of this excess stuff. We're attacked by two Moredhel on the way, and they do some damage, but we manage to kill them.
We reach Zun, and I'm surprised to find that it's not a menu town like LaMut. Instead, we have to walk up to the individual buildings and click on the doors. It's mostly a waste of time. The tavern is closed, the residents of the houses unfriendly--one hits Locklear with a wine bottle. One abandoned house yields some money and a bowstring. There's an herb and potion shop (Kege's Herbs), but it's not interested in our excess swords and armor.
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Arriving in Zun.
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Needing the certainty of an inn and shop, I head back north to LaMut. It's dark when we arrive, and we head to the inn. Sumani, who we did not re-visit during our previous stay, after speaking to Captain Belford, has some intelligence about the grey warriors with the stolen rubies. He suggests we talk to another "man without honor," Keifer Alescook in the town of Loriel. He's a gem merchant.
We stay the night, apparently in a common room, because in addition to the 5 sovereigns we pay for the room, we have about 15 pickpocketed from our money pouch. We make it up at the store after selling our excess armor and swords.
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I think I'd rather sleep outside.
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And here I sign off, mere inches from where we began this session, and yet we learned valuable lessons about exploration, cities, side-quests, treasures, combat, and other game mechanics. We've also had a little character development. In comparison to the beginning of the game, Locklear has increased by 1 strength, 1% in defense, and 1% in melee accuracy; Owyn is up 1% in defense; and Gorath . . . well, Gorath is down 2 strength, 3 defense, 4 crossbow accuracy, 2 melee accuracy, 4 assessment, 2 armorcraft, 2 weaponcraft, and 2 scouting. Someone please enlighten me how that happened.
Time so far: 5 hours
Oh, "the one who draws nets in." I had read "drawer of nets" as "part of the desk where the fishermen keep their equipment" and was very confused.
ReplyDeleteI assumed it was someone who made portraits of Brooklyn basketball players.
DeleteIf you have any kind of debuff / negative condition its affects are factored into the skill ratings shown on your character sheet.
ReplyDeleteBTW this is one of those games where your stats don’t change all that much but your character power does grow significantly by acquiring better equipment and spells (you might have noticed Owyn’s starting spell list does not exactly wow).
As someone who was into hacking back when this was released, let me tell you the stat changes make quite a difference. Starting Owyn with 100 in casting make this game "fun", particularly after he gets Mad Gods Rage :D
DeleteAll right, thanks. I'll take another look after I've had a chance to fully heal.
DeleteInjuries can temporarily reduce all your skills, so I suspect that may be what’s going on with Gorath (and your other characters may have banked greater increases than you’re currently seeing, for that matter, if they’re not fully healed). In general getting badly injured sucks - at critical health you’re taking big skill penalties, healing is slow, and Owen can’t do much magic, so trying to keep everyone topped up - including resting in combat as much as you can - is more important than in more traditional DnDish systems where being at 1 hp is no biggie and healing is easy.
ReplyDeleteRunning with SHIFT definitely was big in this era - Doom did it and so I think many other games used the same controls.
I’ve used similar tools to brute-force riddles or puzzles like this - I wrote a Word macro that automatically deletes anything not in the spell-checker which speeds things up! Though for this game that might be less helpful since as I recall some of the puzzles you get later involve proper nouns or in-setting words that aren’t proper English.
I actually really love all the little bits of narration — they add a bunch of flavor and are quick to click through once you’ve already seen them. I kinda bracket BaK and the Quest for Glory games together in some ways, since they have systems that make you feel like you’re actually in a fantasy world where you need to eat, sleep, and do stuff other than just be a murderhobo, combined with prose that adds some pleasant texture to all the quotidian interactions (you can of course do all the same stuff in Skyrim, but lacking the above elements it doesn’t feel as engaging to me, though possibly it’s just that I was a teenager when I played BaK and QfG :)
Regarding running with SHIFT, I am sure Chester will be delighted to know this was also a feature in DOOM precursor "Spear of Destiny."
DeleteI was trying to figure out how I could build a dictionary into my filtering process, but I don't know enough about coding. That's pretty cool.
DeleteThanks for the tips on health. I clearly didn't appreciate this enough. Trying to play after the chest blew up in Owyn's face was probably never going to work.
Looking back at some old comments reminds me that SHIFT-move* was even a run key in Rogue and Nethack. It didn't let you move faster in-game, but kept your character moving in the same direction till you hit a wall. This effectively served as an alternative to "quit without saving," because it was a good way to get killed. (Probably. I don't think I ever used it in Nethack.)
Delete*"move" here tends not to be arrow keys but the notorious vi-keys.
I believe you're correct: the polygonal hills (all but the most gently-sloping kind) are impassable. As you already found, it can certainly sometimes be worth your while to stray from the beaten path.
ReplyDeleteI felt that the menu towns struck a nice compromise. In the small villages one can actually visit each individual building, but a supposedly bustling large city rendered that way would seem too small and/or too unpopulated.
Finally, I was intrigued by your use of MS Access to solve the puzzle box; that's a program I've never used. Also amused, of course, in light of the recent "MS = Evil" discussion elsewhere on this site. I have to admit that I don't think I've ever heard database software used as a reason to malign Microsoft.
Menu cities may address the population problem, but on the flipside I've always found in weird how, as a result, there's less to do in the cities than in villages.
DeleteRight. I get the logic of making the big cities menus and the small cities not, but I still somehow would have expected the reverse.
DeleteI honestly couldn't think of any other way to get every combination of multiple letters except to make each letter position a unique table and then bring all the tables into a query with no joins. If anyone can think of an Excel or Python solution, I'd be interested in hearing it.
The reverse is how things were run in the later Gold Box games - villages and such were just brief menus, but larger towns were full maps. I agree that it feels like the player is being cheated by saying "here's the wonderfully big, complex city" and then not letting them actually experience anything outside of short menu options.
DeleteThere are online tools that solve for word scrambles. You could probably write something in python that'd feed every possible permutation into one of those tools and spit out the legitimate 1 word answers.
DeleteWoops! Meant that comment for the previous thread!
DeleteAre there online tools that solve this particular kind, though? There are plenty of anagram solvers, but I can't think of anything I've seen where you can feed in something like (A or K or L or U) AND (H or J or E or X) etc.
DeleteAnyway, even if there are, I think that would be cheating. Building something myself doesn't feel like cheating.
Right, that's why you'd need something to figure out each possible permutation based on the letter wheels, then feed each one to the anagram checker, which should theoretically discard the vast majority of possibilities. Or you could use a spellchecker dictionary... hmm. This would be pretty fun to write, although since I'm sure there's a spoiler list out there for all of these chests it'd be a pretty silly waste of time.
DeleteAnagram solvers help with scrambles, but they would not be much help here where the positions are correct but you need to find the right letters. Writing a program that produces all combinations and checks them against a dictionary would be simple though.
DeleteIn something unixish you'd use
Deletegrep -i '^[erob][tsau][rwot][ilhr][ondt][swge]$' /usr/share/dict/words
Or one could simply ask ChatGPT:
Delete"Write a Python program that takes as input N sequences of M letters and generates a list of words where the first letter can be any of the first in each sequence, the second any of the second, and so on. After, compare it with another list that has all the words in the English language and output the matching words".
Trying with the "Barrow" example above, the resulting program ouputs 27 words (including the correct guess).
Of course, at that point, one might as well look to a guide for the solution...
What you are looking for is called Cartesian product. Python's itertools has a function for it:
Delete```
import itertools
tumblers = [list("ETRIOS"), list("RSWLNW"), ... ]
print('\n'.join(''.join(list) for list in itertools.product(*tumblers)))
```
You can then inspect the list manually or use some extra module to find known words. E.g. with pyspellchecker (https://pypi.org/project/pyspellchecker/)
Delete```
from spellchecker import SpellChecker
spell = SpellChecker()
print(spell.known(list_generated_in_my_previous_post))
```
There is some polishing to do (e.g. remove the '\n'.join if you want to feed the list to the spell checker) but should be faster that using Access.
I wrote the entries of tumblers wrong; using your example, they should be
Deletetumblers = [list("EROB"), list("TSAU"), ... ]
Stamina and health are basically just different pools of hit points. Stamina is lost first and with no adverse effect on the character. When stamina is gone you start losing health instead, and your stats decrease based on the percentage of health you've lost -- so a character at low health manifests his condition by being useless until healed. It makes for a feeling of realism but also creates death spirals where a character who's losing will start losing progressively harder.
ReplyDeleteEarly-game crossbows are trash, IMO. They get better later, but melee remains more consistently useful.
Yes, the death spiral mechanic combined with the slow healing process let me reload on fights more often than I'd want to - both are laudable, more realistic approaches which unfortunately take the fun out of combat: you're bound to lose something (strength, skill, stamina) by engaging a foe.
DeleteOther thoughts on the combat system?
Restart in combat also replenishes stamina but never health, IIRC, so that’s another reason to try to avoid health damage - I remember rest-spamming in combats with traps could sometimes work well.
DeleteI did like the system’s focus on positioning - the combat areas are a little too small to live up to the full potential, but I remember having fun using Invitation to drag baddies through traps, or get enemy mages into melee.
The combat system would benefit from offering more meaningful options for fighter-types. As it is, the mages get a variety of cool tricks while the mundanes get "equip sword" and "shoot crossbow once before melee".
DeleteTetrapod points out how spells can move enemies around for tactical advantage; it'd be nice if fighters could get in on that with a charge or something.
(Granted, having versatile mages and one-trick fighters is a common RPG system problem.)
I never loved the combat system, the fights were all pretty samey and mages abilities were often too tricky to get off. I would advise Chet to freely use all the consumable items he comes across. I ended the game with my inventory absolutely overflowing with full stacks of most things.
Delete"shoot crossbow once before melee".
Delete----
Which, let's admit it, kind of realistic.)
My main gripe with the combat system is that melee fighters cannot "tie" their opponents. Even when they are supposedly locked in the sword combat, NPC still able to freely move around and attack other characters.
Thanks, guys. This thread (and some of the comments above) clear up a lot of the questions I had about health, stamina, and combat.
DeleteThe literary qualities of R.E. Feist's works aside, I think the coverage of this game greatly benefits from you having read the preceding novels.
ReplyDeleteAgreed. I'm very happy I took the time to do that. I'm listening to an audio version of Sethanon as I commute, so I should have a better grasp of that in a couple of weeks, too.
DeleteI do agree on that. Otherwise, it might feel like the usual "we just made up a bunch of words that sound fantasy-like" (which, in truth, it is - but it started with Feist, not the game authors) instead of a decently deep - if somewhat borrowed - world background.
DeleteXKCD's "Fiction rule of thumb" comes to mind:
Deletehttps://xkcd.com/483/
I'd say Feist's language is perfectly cromulent.
DeleteI certainly felt embiggened after reading the Riftwar Saga for the first time.
DeleteAlso, nice 'Pirates' reference in the menu town caption.
ReplyDeleteIn general you'll want to keep damage to the stamina track and avoid as best you can taking any damage to your health. It heals significantly slower and damages all your skills. Also I suspect the accuracy % does not take the enemy Defense skill into account but I wouldn't swear to it, so that's why you're seeing weird variances.
ReplyDeleteThere's a lot of tricks in the game to make a lot more money but they're tedious, like activating the haggle skill and haggling every single item in a shop then backing out and doing it again, or activating bard skill just before performing in a tavern for money. It's not needed, but the game also is very much not easy if you want to accomplish everything so if you want to do it all you'll have to optimize.
Just focusing on melee attack / defense is great for getting through.
Taking the time early on to level up the barding skill will significantly pay dividends down the line. It will require money for a practice lute and plenty of rations
ReplyDelete„ this game narrates everything as if it's part of a book.“
ReplyDeleteWhen I played this game, many, many years ago, I couldn’t grasp this simple truth. I didn’t have your quasi scientific journey through years of experiencing the evolution of CRPGs, but I could feel that BaK was somehow different.
I hope you still enjoy it at the end, I surely did. This is truly a whole new level of textual quality to what we’ve seen before. And all those years I that Mr Feist himself would have written a lot of the texts. It’s only now that I realize he was just advising. Anyway, his advice was great.
I really appreciate how the password chests seem to use wholly original puzzles instead of recycling the standard, cliché ones that appear in so many of these games. It's very refreshing not having to sit through the usual 'what has four legs in the morning, two in the afternoon and three at night' type riddles.
ReplyDeleteI agree. I hope it holds.
DeleteBetween your playthrough and finally meeting Neal Hallford last month, I'm being successfully tempted to play this one again! I got about halfway through as a kid, but my ability to maintain attention long enough to finish games wasn't great back then.
ReplyDeleteOne of the main things to find by exploring off to the side of the main roads are more word puzzle chests but being colourblind I had a lot of trouble spotting them in the green and brown dominant 3-D landscape, so I imagine you may have the same issue.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure it's already happened.
DeleteI think Skyrim used shift to run.
ReplyDeleteI think that's more or less the standard for first/third person games with wasd movement. Most recently I played Remnant 2 that used shift to sprint.
DeleteNot sure how many such games (on PC) Chet would have experienced, though.
Cyberpunk 2077 is also a shift to sprint game. Of course, you can bind it to whatever you'd like...
DeleteMost things in this game are there for a reason. Just one clue in German "Wimmelbild".
ReplyDeleteTrue! I remember I was quite surprised when I found out!
DeleteTaverns and inns in the overworld (i.e. not in town screens like LaMut) are only open past noon, so most likely you tried to enter the one in Zun in the morning. I guess "it's five o' clock somewhere" doesn't apply in Midkemia.
ReplyDeleteIIRC, one nice interface touch is that if you're not into hunting pixels on the town screens, you can simply press TAB to cycle through all available options. But you might find some surprise interactions as a result. Up to you whether you'd rather keep the joy of a surprise mouseover or not.
ReplyDeleteAlso, it was nice to get a callback to that old well riddle which appeared in both Zork 2 and Ultima 5. But it was really hard when I played Zork as a kid, it took me a long time to figure it out in a time before the Web.
"What retcons, surplaying, and twists of logic have you used to justify dillydallying?"
ReplyDelete"It's just a game."
But seriously, having some fun with the premise:
Mass Effect: Shepard is secretly being indoctrinated by the Reapers, so that unconsciously he always avoid theost direct lead towards stopping them.
Ultima 7: The Avatar starts thinking that those Fellowship guys are not so bad after all, they even seem happy to have him around unlike that ungrateful Lord British, so where's the problem?
Fallout: Let'em drink Nuka Cola!
Coincidentally, I am currently more or less forcing myself to play through Fallout 4 after bouncing off of it several times, and one of the major reasons I did in the past was in fact due to the inconsistent, if not contradictory way the game handles character motivation and urgency vs the open world in front of you. (And after finally playing it for about 30+ hours I must also say it probably has the most I'll thought out, shoehorned in romance options ever. One of my recent waking memories is my spouse getting murdered in front of my eyes while my son was being kidnapped... So of course I would immediately start romancing the drugged-out cage fighter I've somehow stumbled into owning her slave contract to, or the pushy self proclaimed reporter that would rather roam the wastes with a complete stranger than looking after her kid sister, or the android whose naivete regarding the outside world might just as well make her like a child - maybe it's just me, but I find each and every of these choices questionable (if not icky), and with the thought of the murdered spouse in my mind it makes the player character come off like a sociopath...)
ReplyDeleteOof, Fallout 4. While I enjoy the game as an amazing sandbox RPG, the main story and especially its patented Bethesda twist just left me completely cold. I never could finish it, either. I felt the same way about Starfield's twist. I stopped playing that after the big reveal as well.
DeleteThere's a mod for Fallout 4 called "Start Me Up" that lets you delete the built-in main character motivation and substitute your own by letting you be e.g. a wastelander or raider who stumbles across the starting vault. I only played the very beginning (which worked fine) but it purports to fix dialogues throughout the game. I've been meaning to try a playthrough using it in conjunction with another mod that makes the protagonist unvoiced, but I haven't made the time.
Deletehttps://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/56984
Also currently (re)playing Fallout 4. I'm not so bothered by the lack of urgency to follow after my kid - it's endemic in most RPGs that side quests are a silly thing that no serious person pursuing the main quest, which is always very urgent, would ever consider stopping for. ("The world is ending but you need 3 sacks of potatoes from the next town over? Okay. Be back in a bit with those.") But since I'm a side quest junky, I just go with the cognitive dissonance of the deal and almost treat it as two separate games - the alternate universe where I don't need to worry about the main quest, and then finally the main quest. (The romancing options are a whole separate thing. I don't usually end up pursuing them, in part for the reasons listed above.)
DeleteIronically, I think this plot vs. gameplay inconsistency comes from a desire to give the player a clear explanation why they're involved in the story while avoiding the "final act surprise villain" issue.
DeleteI was just thinking about a game that does a pretty brilliant job avoiding this problem, 1995's Exile (later remade several times as Avernum). Since Chet is likely to actually play this game at some point, I'll avoid spoilers, but the game starts with you being dropped into what is essentially a huge underground penal colony full of monsters. That makes "get stronger and make friends in order to survive" a major drive throughout the game, and the actual main plotlines of the game grow organically from that. Your characters are not special in any way, nor do they have any particular connection to the major figures of the plot. The Wizardry side of the genre, rather than Ultima, if you will.
Has any game really ever successfully bridged that gap? I don't know that I've ever played one.
Mass Effect 2 and to a lesser extent 3 make your quest to essentially build up to fighting the big bad at the end, so it makes sense that you'd go searching around throughout the galaxy in search of something that might give you an edge.
Delete@stepped pyramids Gothic (2001) has a similar approach: you have been tossed into a penal colony and your goal is to escape, which you can probably do best by aligning yourself with one of the three factions within - but how you go about that, the game mostly leaves to you, so the exploration aspect is directly tied into character motivation.
DeleteI also never had a problem with player agency in previous Fallout games. In F2 your goal is to retrieve a GECK, but you have no clue what it is or where to find it, plus you've grown up in a secluded tribal village with little to no idea about the rest of the world, so it makes total sense to stumble around the place, explore every nook and cranny or get lost in the vices the world has to offer.
Fallout 3 also did it pretty good IMO: your goal is to find your father, but the second you leave the Vault you realize that all your life you've been lied to, so to me it makes total sense to start exploring and learning more about the place by yourself before eventually confronting your parent about it (granted once you do it becomes a bit of a letdown, but that's the typical Bethesda plot issue again).
While it's more "RPG-adjacent" than "RPG", I notice that the recent Legend of Zelda game (BotK) differentiates between "Side quests", which are basically "do a random favor for someone because you are a hero of the people" and "side adventures", which involve learning more about the nature of the impending apocalypse or repairing the damage done by said impendingness.
Delete"Fallout 3 also did it pretty good IMO: your goal is to find your father, but the second you leave the Vault you realize that all your life you've been lied to." It's a pretty benign lie, though, isn't it? You were told that you were born in a vault when in fact you've only been in the vault since you were so young you don't have any memories otherwise. You've been told that the vault never opens when in fact it occasionally opens. I don't know that I'd really feel "betrayed" by those revelations.
DeleteI think FO3 is a fun game but it's structured badly. The main quest is shockingly short and uses a tiny percentage of the map. You don't find out about the "evil" path until it's probably too late. And to me there's never a moment in which the next step on the main quest doesn't feel like an emergency. Not to mention that if you DO stop and smell the roses, you run hard into the level cap.
Best way to role-play FO3 in my opinion is to make sure you have the Broken Steel expansion, do the main quest, and then decide you don't care enough about the Brotherhood of Steel to prioritize going after the Enclave. After that, you have no particular reason not to just wander wherever.
DeleteActually in my personal headcanon (and having the "Tale of two Wastelands" mod installed) what with everyone giving you shit about you "having to be the one" activating the Purifier when Fawkes is a perfectly viable option (but then again even the Brotherhood are pretty much racist bigots), my character said "Screw this noise" about the capitol wasteland and everyone in it, boarded a train to New Vegas and began a second life as a bitter, jaded courier. Then, when some bastard in a checkered suit put a bullet in your brainpan (giving you a bit of short term memory loss about the past few weeks but not everything in general), you set out determined to make that guy pay, but since you know where he lives and you havE to earn your way into New Vegas anyway, you take your sweet time devising different ways of how to enact your revenge on that guy, getting caught up in the next big conflict anyway and, through the help of some of your companions (I like Raul, Boone and Lilly in particular) start to care about this area and the people in it again (or get pushed entirely over the brink and decide "screw them all"), setting your course for the rest of the game.
Delete[I]It's a pretty benign lie, though, isn't it? You were told that you were born in a vault when in fact you've only been in the vault since you were so young you don't have any memories otherwise. You've been told that the vault never opens when in fact it occasionally opens. I don't know that I'd really feel "betrayed" by those revelations.[/I]
Yeah, kind of true, but even with a being lie, by your father nonetheless, upheld for your entire life, it's bound to make you question what other things might not have been true. I don't know, it works for me. I agree with the plot of FO3 being badly structured though (heck, on my first playthrough I was so set on exploring the Wastes instead of the main plot that I accidentally stumbled onto Tranquility Lane way before reaching Rivet City, thus accidentally skipping a huge part of the plot. Oh well... Personally I prefer New Vegas anyway (and I really hope that should Bethesda ever get around to make a Fallout 5, they finally make the protagonist something else than a Vault Dweller. My favorite games in the series are FO2 and New Vegas, and I think it's not much of a coincidence that both games don't have the protagonist come from a Vault.
Exile's from 1994! Vogel himself stated as much.
DeleteI keep bringing this up because of how much I look forward to this blog's coverage of the game. A year's difference in release date makes a lot more than one year in blog posts. I hope I'm not starting to be annoying about making this point.
So, I had a quick look into this, and it turns out there’s some subtlety here.
DeleteI have a copy of the very first public release of Exile, Exile 1.0. The file data is all intact, which means I can date the release. The latest date listed in the file modification data is 1st February 1995 (with most of the other files modified on January 30th, or January 31st). In addition, the ‘Bug Report Form’ says that Exile is copyright 1995. So the very first *public release* of Exile seems to have been in *February 1995*.
But that’s not the end of the story. The internal version number of the 1.0 program wasn’t changed from one of the beta releases of the game. It describes itself as release B1.1.2, crucially with a copyright of 1994. There’s also a guide included with this release, ‘Getting started in Exile’. While this file was last modified in January 1995, the copyright date included at the top says 1994. The file data implies that one of these beta releases could have been on 2nd December 1994, and no earlier than 23rd July 1994 (when two of the data files were first created). So it seems the first *private/beta* releases of Exile were in *late 1994*.
So Exile’s release year depends on what you count as a release. If you allow private/beta releases, it’s a 1994 game. But if you only allow for public releases, it’s from 1995!
Oh! Thank you for digging into it. I'll regard that as definitive.
DeleteThe quote I had in mind reads, "Our new games are now $25, exactly the same as our first game, Exile: Escape From the Pit, back in 1994," from the blog post at
https://bottomfeeder.substack.com/p/we-released-queens-wish-2-the-tormentor
I guess if the beta had a wide enough release, or Vogel was already charging money during the beta, then it would be natural for him to misremember the date.
Crossbows in BaK are mostly a supplement to the sword attacks. You hit an enemy once, maybe twice, as it comes at you to soften him up. Tsurani Heavy Crossbow or Bessy Mauler + Enchanted Quarrels can kill many enemies easily, but it costs a lot of money and often you don't have an access to a shop selling the Enchanted Quarrels. Elven Crossbow + Elven Quarrels offer less power, but a much better accuracy. Accurate shots also increase the skill at a faster rate.
ReplyDeleteMaybe a hot take, but I really loved in Pathfinder Kingmaker, that not following the main quest has bad consequences.
ReplyDeleteThe narrative verbosity made me chuckle, since it reminded me of the interactive fiction parody "Sycamora Tree" by David Dyte.
ReplyDelete