Thursday, October 29, 2026

Pagan: The Beginning of Wisdom

The Avatar is a bit slow.
        
Plot check: The Avatar has been stranded on the world of Pagan by the Guardian, who continues to taunt him with hints about the devastation he is inflicting on Britannia while the Avatar tries to find a way back. (How are we supposed to regard these jeers? Are they audible to others? Just in the Avatar's head?) The Avatar has learned from a thaumaturgist named Mythran that to escape Pagan, he will need to master the native forms of magic, each aspected to an element, each dominated by an elemental titan.
   
The Avatar has learned necromancy (earth magic) and has risen to the rank of second-in-command of the necromancers, of whom there seem to be two. He has not learned tempestry (water magic), but he has freed the elemental titan of water, Hydros, from her ancient prison, and she has vowed exact revenge on the city of Tenebrae and the descendants of the tempest who imprisoned her. He has made tentative contact with the sorcerers (fire magic) and has learned that he'll need to learn a flying spell to cross the river of lava and to reach the sorcerers. Finally, he has passed the initial tests to become a theurgist. Theurgy is aspected to air, the domain of Stratos, whose followers study the healing arts. Stratos seems unique among the titans in not being a complete knob, but then again, I haven't met her yet.
     
A test of "all I have learned" turns out to be one spell.
           
We resume with the Avatar, having constructed his theurgistic focuses, returning to the leader of the theurgists, Stellos. Stellos tells me that now that I have all the theurgistic spells, I will need to return to the caverns under the monastery, where I had found the silver ore used to make the focuses. "You will know what to do when you arrive there," he assures.
   
Shortly after I arrive in the caverns, I find a wounded torax, heavily breathing on the ground. Feeling mischievous, I try to kill it. The game doesn't even acknowledge the swings of my sword. I sigh, open up my focus/potion bag, and select "Healing Touch." The torax stops his heavy breathing and, after a moment, disappears.
     
Did some sick bastard wound a torax just so I could come down here and heal it?
    
The torax was on a little island that I had to jump down to. Now, I die three times trying to jump back to the main part of the dungeon. I end up using the Recall Item to go to the Argentrock Isle teleporter pad, then walk back to Stellos. I imagine that there are probably more tests in the dungeon, but since I have to pass him anyway, it doesn't hurt to check. To my surprise, I have a dialogue option that "I have passed the third test."
   
Stellos congratulates me but says my further education will have to wait, as "a terrible thing has happened": someone has stolen Brother Xavier's focus of healing. Stellos is careful to clarify that if this thief is found, Stellos will not hold a grudge but will "help him find the path of Enlightenment again." 
     
What a bunch of hippies.
     
Stellos makes it clear that he doesn't have any leads, so I don't know what's going to be occupying the time that he would have spent guiding me to my next test. Certainly, he's not going to be looking for it. Nonetheless, this is clearly my problem to solve. I start poking around. Cyrrus just repeats what Stellos told me, adding that the item was stolen while Xavier slept. Torwin, who doesn't remember my name from our previous encounter, has nothing new to offer.
    
I find Xavier in his house. He says the focus was stolen from a chest next to his bed. Given that he's a light sleeper, whoever stole it would have had to be very stealthy. He tells me that Torwin is a very "strange" student, given to lurking around people's houses at night. He has been asking about the "Resurrection" spell, apparently only given by Stratos to one adept at a time. Casting this spell is how Stellos lost his eyesight. Anyway, Torwin has also repeatedly failed the third test despite his advancing rapidly through the first two.
   
During our conversation, Xavier mentions that Stratos has provided the means of learning the truth, which reminds me of the "Hear Truth" spell. Its focus looks like a chain. I cast it and run around speaking to everyone again. I don't think the spell is perfect, as Torwin still insists that he made his focus correctly (the third test) on his first try. However, Cyrrus has some new information: he thinks Torwin stole the focus; he's covering for Torwin; Torwin went to Windy Point on some kind of errand.
      
This is a cute way to represent the effects of the spell—what he says in regular text, the truth in parentheticals—except it doesn't seem to work on any other NPC.
      
I find Torwin on the plateau near the two stone pillars that look out over the sea. After some prodding (in which "Hear Truth" seems to do nothing), he admits to "borrowing" the focus. He tells me he's the son of Toran, the man executed by Mordea at the beginning of the game. Torwin thought that by combining two focuses, he can make the standard "Healing Touch" spell more powerful, perhaps even affecting the equivalent of a "Resurrection" spell without needing to know that spell. Torwin did not realize that Toran was cast into the sea for Hydros, and he loses it when I tell him. He insists that he will bring his father back, that he doesn't even need the extra focus, which he tosses at my feet. "I am strong enough to do it on my own! And I will! I'm coming for you, father!!" He then runs and jumps off the promontory into the sea and drowns.
     
I have never been so confused about someone's plan.
         
(This was all hinted when I spoke to Rhian, Toran's wife, several entries ago: "Their son, Torwin, has gone off to be a Theurgist, something that confuses Rhian because he never expressed any interest in becoming a healer when he was growing up." I had forgotten about that. It's not a bad motivation. When I met Torwin last session, I was convinced he was going to get jealous that I was advancing faster than him. I'm glad his story was more complicated than that.)
    
In addition to the focus, he threw his ring on the ground. I pick up both objects and return to Xavier. He gratefully receives the focus but doesn't ask me where I found it. When I speak to Stellos, my dialogue option to introduce the subject is, amusingly, "Poor Torwin." Stellos already seems to know what happened to the kid, which is a bit mystifying. Anyway, he says that I'm ready for the final test, which is to go jump off the very promontory at which Torwin committed suicide. 
   
Well, I have the power of Reload and Torwin didn't. I go, stand between the pillars, and jump. Of course, this time, there's a floating rock waiting for me on the other side. I jump from rock to rock, eventually nearing a platform with a swirling gale upon it: Stratos. As I get close, Stratos sends a whirlwind to knock me down, then lift me up and float me over to her. "And yet another child is found. Please, small one, come closer." 
      
It's not like you gave me any choice.
       
The Avatar's only response is a supremely stupid "Who are you?" She, of course, introduces herself as Stratos, the titan of air. She says that she invests her "chosen children" with the power of healing through the "Breath of Wind," the location of which is known only to Stellos. I have the option to say, "May I have the Breath of Wind?" and then to insist "I must have the Breath of Wind" when she says no. She still declines: "Without the Breath of Wind, many would die. Many would pay the price for your quest for power. No, child, I cannot allow this." I mean, good for her. I don't know why the Avatar is demanding this power in the first place. At first, I think it's the power that will allow him to fly across the lava to the sorcerers, but no, she gives me a focus that will let me cast "Air Walk" and presumably accomplish that task. So I'm not sure what the Avatar was going on about.
 
Stratos, incidentally, came across as a touch arrogant but still not evil like Lithos or Hydros. 
   
"Air Walk" doesn't seem to work to levitate me back to the promontory. Just like "Hear Truth," I gather that it's far more limited than its description would suggest, useful only at specific locations to solve scripted plot points. I verify this by returning to Tenebrae and re-talking to everyone with "Hear Truth" active. No one has any parenthetical dialogue. There are, however, some new bits of dialogue related to events since the last time I spoke with them:
   
  • A couple of the guards invite me to join them for a drink at the tavern.
  • Jenna, the server in the tavern, remarks that "some fool" released Hydros but won't believe me when I tell her it was me. That's cute, but I was hoping she'd have some dialogue about Cyrrus. 
      
What "type," exactly, releases a titan?
         
  • Shaana, the executioner, doesn't seem to know that Mordea is dead even though she was there.
  • Darion, the captain who trains people in east Tenebrae, has something to say about most of the NPCs I met. His wife died shortly after she gave birth to Jenna. Jenna has refused marriage offers from just about every eligible man in Tenebrae, but Darion thinks I might have what it takes. When I speak to him again, I have the option to say, "Yes, I want to marry your daughter!" When I do, he sheepishly tells me that Jenna has sworn to kill any man that is chosen for her to marry. The game forces me to back out of the conversation with no resolution. It would have been pretty mean to Cyrrus anyway. I spend 50 gold to train with Darion, though to no purpose since my statistics are already at their maximums. 
     
What do I have to lose? It's not like I'm going to be staying.
       
  • Cyrrus mentioned a bunch of people: Jenna, Darion, his parents. There are no dialogue options with any of them to report on how Cyrrus is doing.
  • Several people remark on the "terrible weather." There are puddles on the streets everywhere from all the rain.
  • The conversation I dread most is with Rhian, and of course the Avatar starts it clumsily with: "I found this ring." Upon further prodding, I have the option to tell Rhian that Torwin had an accident, committed suicide, or just "passed away." I choose the neutral option, and all she says is, "Perhaps we shall speak later." When I speak to her again, she gratefully takes the ring and sobs.
      
The Avatar just piles it on.
       
  • Kilandra didn't know Devon had been made tempest. She also doesn't believe that I released Hydros. 
        
The fish always know.
      
I had assumed this "Bane" person would be the one to teach me the flying spell. Again, we see the hand of fate. When I walked away from the river of lava, resolutely continuing to follow the right wall, then encountering the theurgists, I thought I was doing My Own Thing. It turns out that's exactly what I had to do.
   
When I'm ready to resume my explorations, instead of going back to the lava lake, I continue my rightmost wall pattern from where the caverns exited at Argentrock Isle. (Oh, I just got it: "Argentrock" = "silver ore.") "Divination" calls this set of caverns the Upper Catacombs, which I thought applied to a different map. This turns out to be correct. After I wrap around the cave for a while, finding nothing but mushrooms and bones, I find myself back in the other Upper Catacombs, this one looking less like a cave and more like a . . . well, catacombs. 
   
I'm kind of back to the beginning at this point, but I spend some time peeking in on places I've already visited to find their proper names and ensure that I have an accurate map. Sometimes, the spell says I'm "totally lost" instead of giving me the area's name, so I have to go with my own names.
       
This is the Cemetery. I've been here many times.
        
Some findings:
      
  • I never find an obvious place to use the Skull of Quakes. 
  • I can't seem to get back to the Lower Catacombs (or whatever they were called) to find the ancient necromancers; the room where I fell down the hole in the floor seems to be gone entirely.
  • Commenter Joshua suggested that I visit the cave in the Valley after I was done with the theurgists. I'm not sure why, as the reason I couldn't make any progress here last time was because of locked doors. None of my theurgist spells do anything about locked doors. I can't find any other way to move forward here, so I'll take another hint if anyone has one to offer.
  • There's a cave on the north wall of the Plateau that I completely missed the first time. It has more fireballs shooting out of the walls than the other caves, where it's already overdone. A trapped chest in here contains a mace called "Bonecrusher." This weapon is mentioned in The Saga of Bone Crusher. It kills skeletons permanently without having to cast "Grant Peace." Otherwise, I don't know whether it's better than Protector, but I'll hold onto it.
  • There's a large double-door in this cave, with a ton of dead bodies strewn in front of it. I search every single goddamned one of them and don't find a key. Mythran's spell doesn't work. And the whole time, I'm attacked by invisible enemies that don't show themselves when I cast "Reveal." Again, light hints welcome. 
     
Apparently, a lot of people died trying to get through this door.
       
  • The area west of West Tenebrae turns out to be called Fishermans Reef, no apostrophe, according to the spell.
  • Someone said I could open the locked door in the Pit of Death by casting "Create Golem" on a patch of earth. I mix the spell, but I cannot find any patch of earth in the area on which to cast it. 
      
Lots of mushrooms, but no earth.
          
  • Shamhat alerted me to a lever in my screenshot of a chest completely surrounded by a fence in the caverns north of Carthax Lake (where I freed Hydros). I return there, lower the fence with the lever, and find that the chest is full of useless death disks and poison potions.
          
My map of the game so far. I can't really make the underground geography work.
        
Eventually, I'm back at the Lava River, where I walk to the edge of the lava, cast "Air Walk," move west, and immediately fall into the lava and die. I fiddle around a bit. It turns out "Air Walk" works with jumping; it really just makes you jump extra far. Not quite the "Fly" spell I was promised. I cross the lava, then a river, and finally emerge in the outdoors at a place that "Divination" tells me is called Daemon's Crag. I assume I'll meet the sorcerers here.
 
I guess this is where water from Hydros's prison is now flowing into the Lava River.
         
I don't feel like I accomplished much this session, but I cleared up some loose ends and was able to properly label my map.
   
Timestamp: 42 hours
    
****
   
    
Next entry in this series
10/28/2026  

35 comments:

  1. I believe with the Wounded Torax you are supposed to use Aerial Servant to bring it up to you, instead of jumping down. At least, that is how I recall handling it.

    ReplyDelete
  2. "How are we supposed to regard these jeers? Are they audible to others? Just in the Avatar's head?"

    I assumed it works exactly like in Ultima 7, where there was dialog making it explicit that it's only audible to the target.

    ReplyDelete
  3. There is one portion of gameplay that I don't see here at all, and it is combat. Now that Avatar has 3/4th of his magic, maxed out his stats, and is well equipped, is it any more fun that it was at the beginning?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No. It wasn't really even any fun at the beginning. It's a lot of clicking and missing and trying to get the Avatar to face the right direction. The only time I fight battles these days is when enemies won't leave me alone and I can't just run away.

      Delete
  4. AlphabeticalAnonymousOctober 29, 2026 at 1:18 PM

    So Stratos is a Vorlon? Or, the Avatar is?

    ReplyDelete
  5. If I'm not mistaken, the large double-door in the cave would've been the entrance to the cancelled Lost Vale expansion pack.

    "Hear Truth" really shows the flaws with this game's rushed development and cut content. It's such an awesome idea for a spell because it really inspires the player's mind of what could be possible. There is so much fun to be had by writing "truth" dialogue especially for stuff that's not story relevant. But by not doing anything with it, it's so jarring and the game would actually have been better by cutting it as well.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I don't think I've ever seen a game where a spell like "Hear Truth" would be implemented in a way that would matter in an entire game and not just in a couple of places.

      I also think that in most cases these "small" spells are incredibly powerful and game-breaking.

      Delete
    2. That's right about the Lost Vale. According to Sheri Graner Ray who worked on SI and VIII, Lost Vale is in an apropos twist, lost to time since Origin didn't archive anything back then.

      https://www.gamebanshee.com/interviews/110859-ultima-viii-the-lost-valearthurian-legends-rpg-interview.html

      Delete
    3. @RandomGamer: let me introduce you to a game called Divinity II: Dragon Knight Saga, where you can spend XP to read minds. Anyone's minds. Including animals, NPCs, specific enemies, etc. It is a very wild time if you go all in on this in a run. Changes how more than a few quests can end as well.

      Delete
    4. @RandomGamer I was more hoping for fun banter (like a townperson saying "Greetings, Stranger! (You look suspicious, I don't trust you)" or "How are you doing? (My, I would like you to teach me some virtues and me to teach you some vices)") and some optional rewards ("(Is this Karl, the guy I'm supposed to give this coin purse to?)" - which would be very un-Avatar-like to lie, but also not out of line with Pagan's theming). It's okay if the spell has limited actual use, but the lack of optional uses stands out like a sore thumb.

      Delete
    5. Baldur's Gate has a pretty healthy store of alternate dialogue for NPCs who have been Charmed. It's a nice touch, especially considering the fact that most players will never see most of it.

      Delete
    6. Damn, you're telling me I have to do ANOTHER playthrough?

      Delete
    7. Seriously. I must have played BG a dozen times and I never knew this. I'm not sure I ever even cast that spell.

      Delete
  6. Just a friendly reminder than in Ultima Underworld II The Guardian, which "inspired" goblin population to fight humans under his control, was referred to as "Red Titan":

    https://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2022/04/ultima-underworld-ii-multiverse-of.html

    ReplyDelete
  7. Regarding theurgy and locked doors, you may want to re-read the descriptions of your spells.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I guess I'm being dense. I could see "Aerial Servant" helping if the issue was a lever out of reach, but otherwise I don't see what would help with a door that seems to need a key.

      Delete
    2. I may be misremembering things, but aren't areal servants supposed to be able to pass through walls?

      Delete
  8. Honest question: are there any games that anyone knows about, that are similar to Ultima 8 - but which are actually GOOD? Because Ultima 8 was such a letdown that Richard Garriot actually issued an apology for it... but there was something there that I felt deserved more than what it got. Are there any games with a similar feel, but which lacked the many problems that existed with Ultima 8?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Depending on what you wanted out of it they did reuse the engine to make Crusader...

      But since you're probably more thinking about RPGs Larian's first game in that genre is pitched as a blend of Diablo and Ultima that ends up feeling a bit like Pagan! It's a little broken and kind of cool, definitely an improvement.

      Delete
    2. Xanadu Next gave me a similar vibe - isometric, small open(-ish) world that's mostly dungeon, platforming elements and puzzles, somewhat grimdark setting.

      Delete
    3. Guess I should have specified that the game I was thinking of is called Divine Divinity...

      Delete
    4. Divine Divinity is closer to Ultima VII (it's the closest RPG I know that's close to U7) - there is no platforming for instance.

      Gothic/Risen/Elex may be the best example. Or, if you move outside RPGs, Little Big Adventure.

      Delete
    5. Dammit, I finally remember - the concept reminds me the most of Super Mario RPG series on Nintendo DS (I'm not sure, maybe there were other Super Mario RPG series on other Nintendo consoles, but I never owned an earlier one).

      To Nintendo's credit, they DO know how to make the "Super Avatar Brothers" work well. THAT experience they do have.

      Delete
    6. I always hear about this about DivDiv being similar to U7, but I just don't see it. Yes, it's isometric and you can move some items around and I guess a couple puzzles in the whole game require it, but that's where the similarity ends. The world isn't really open and its geography makes very little sense, while character development, random item generation, combat and dungeons all owe much more to Diablo than they do to U7 (are basically lifted wholesale from the former). There's also a bit of Fallout mixed in with the reputation system and dialog choices, but that's like 5% of the game.

      The game that's closest to U7 is actually Skyrim.

      Delete
  9. Someone said I could open the locked door in the Pit of Death by casting "Create Golem" on a patch of earth. I mix the spell, but I cannot find any patch of earth in the area on which to cast it.
    If you examine your previous screenshot, you might be enlightened. (Whfg trg pybfre gb gur qbbef.)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I still don't get this. There's earth on the OTHER side of the door, I guess, but I can't cast a spell through a door, can I?

      Delete
    2. There is no "try." There is only "do."

      Delete
  10. > I can't find any other way to move forward here, so I'll take another hint if anyone has one to offer.

    Opening that door is the one (1) sidequest in u8 that actually requires talking to npcs.

    (it's kind of convoluted and easy to miss).

    To start the quest:

    Nfx Beybx gb gryy gnyrf hagvy ur gryyf lbh nobhg n tubfg, gura gnyx gb Wraan nobhg gur tubfg, gura sbyybj gur pyhrf.

    If you need more detailed instructions:

    Nsgre Wraan, fcrnx jvgu Qnevba, gura Tjvyyvz gur ureqfzna, gura uvf jvsr Pbevagu, gura Xvynaqen, gura ybbx sbe gur gbzo bs Xvynaqen qnhtugre va gur przragrel naq pyvpx ba vg.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks. Maybe I'll untangle this. Someone else has suggested that I should be able to do it with the air magic spells I possess, though, so now I don't know what to believe.

      I can't think of a good reason to pursue another side quest in this game, given that I maxed in character development in the first few hours, money is useless, and the last thing I need is yet another magic weapon to juggle.

      Delete
  11. Oh also, another general tip: Now that you have Air servant, remember to use it, it makes things much smoother. You can grab items from inconventient places without needing to wrestle the climbing UI, it can get items from behind bars, activate levers at range, etc.

    ReplyDelete
  12. @Archone, Ultima VIII swinged at many things, but missed most of them, so "like Ultima VIII" is quite in the eye of the beholder. Would something like Gothic qualify, for example?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Actually it's funny how I could not stop thinking about Gothic reading these entries, and how that game, as clunky, janky and sometimes infuriating as it is, does manage to refine what is promised in Ultima 8. Oh Piranha Bytes how much I miss you.

      Delete
  13. "I never find an obvious place to use the Skull of Quakes."

    The skull is used in a small hole in the south-facing wall of a stone structure. Most people would see that hole as bright red, but that doesn't help you very much.

    ReplyDelete

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