The imported party begins! |
Now, this is the kind of god that would cure my atheism. |
I pay for not having channeled points into "Cure Disease" in the first game. |
The beginning of the game is quite hard and took me a few false starts. Ssur's Tower has no services, so I set out to find a town. It turns out that the opening island doesn't have one (or, at least, not yet), so there's not much point in collecting things to sell. It does have a temple, fortunately, on the south coast in the ruined city of Greenbay. Since temples are the only place you can restore the priests' karma points, this became my base of operations.
"Quick" combat against some goblins and trolls. |
A couple of new game elements became clear as I explored. First, monsters vary greatly by terrain. In Wizard's Crown, they varied a lot by area, but I'm not sure that individual squares made a big difference. Here, they do. Walking on grassland is likely to put me in touch with "undead farmers" who are trivially easy; swampland, on the other hand, brings nigh-impossible "swamp things."
But you have to explore every square because of the second game element. In Wizard's Crown, important encounter locations were signaled by icon. You knew to search for a shop on a square that had something that looked like a shop. Dagger has a lot more special encounters on things that look like regular squares. The key is to watch the text at the bottom. Sometimes it changes to note a particular feature in the landscape worth examining more closely with a "search." Sometimes, after a battle, you'll get the option to "follow tracks" back to the monsters' origin. But other times, you get no clue at all, so really you just need to step on and search every square. I found some decent treasure piles on some of those squares, but it's still pretty obnoxious and slow-going.
When "follow" becomes an option, you definitely want to take it. |
There were a few key encounters on the small island map. The most important was with a dragon in the southeast area. He demanded all my magic items and attacked when I refused.
We need more characters named "Torgk." |
I fought the battle in tactical mode and got a couple of my characters killed, but afterwards I raided his hoard and found the "Holy Morningstar," which does a lot of damage and raises the wielder's "Turn Undead" skill by 50 points.
Fighting the sole dragon in "tactical" mode. |
Later, on the northern section of the island, some warriors offered to give me a dragon-slaying sword. I guess I was supposed to encounter them first. I kept it in case I encountered more dragons.
During my explorations of the island, I was of course improving my equipment. With no "evaluate" mechanic, this game just tells you exactly what each item does and how much it's worth. The equipment system has been updated since Wizard's Crown in that pluses (up to +6) and effects like fire and frost aren't mutually exclusive. You can have them both on the same weapon. Items can also have random miscellaneous effects, such as conferring "Invisibility" or raising a random skill by a few points. Almost every battle brought me some upgrade.
A nice treasure cache. |
Development also continues to be swift and rewarding with skills. When skills get over 200 points, it starts taking a lot of experience to raise them by even a point or two, but that's compensated by having each battle deliver more experience than in Wizard's Crown.
Eventually, I found a cave in the northwest part of the island that took me to a much smaller island. This one, in turn, had an entrance to a two-level dungeon. Thankfully, the developers got rid of the party movement system in dungeons. The entire party is represented by a single character, although you can still rotate who that is. Even though there were more combats than the standard Wizard's Crown dungeon, progress was so much faster.
A nice dungeon shot. You basically want to examine every door and piece of furniture. |
There were a couple of tough combats, mostly with undead. One of them, with undead lions, tigers, and bears, I couldn't defeat and had to skirt around. There were a few light puzzles involving finding passwords in one room and reciting them to another. After finishing the first level, I was dangerously close to being out of karma points (necessary to heal after combats), so I limped all the way back to Greenbay to rest at the chapel there.
I never defeated this group. |
The map culminated in a battle with the Necromancer and some undead allies. A note in the Necromancer's study suggests that he was ordered to help with the battle against the elves by someone named "Anawt the Overlord." Whether he's the main villain or just the villain of the next chapter is unknown.
After that, I couldn't find my way out, so I returned to the entrance. The game noted that it collapsed behind me. When I got out, some changes had been wrought to the landscape. The tiny island was now connected to the main island, there were far fewer wandering encounters, and all the swampland had disappeared.
A lot has changed in the few days it took to hike there and back. |
More important, when I got back to Greenbay, I saw that it had been replaced with a full menu town. I sold the excess magic items I had been carrying, paid to enchant a few objects, and took a long respite at the inn. A shipyard in town seems to be the mode of passage to other islands in the game world.
Collecting everything into a single menu town was a nice addition, too. |
I laughed at your third caption. Then I thought, well, you're camping. What if it's a god that delivers hot dogs, baked beans, and s'mores, but nothing else? I think that'd leave me at least quasi-agnostic.
ReplyDeleteI think that only happens if you worship Mel Brooks.
DeleteOr, if the God gives hot dogs, baked beans and snores then asks you if that's what you really really really want, that's Mel B.
DeleteAlso, the name Ssur poses the question, is there a Russ involved in this game? (Having used the name Ssor on occasion, I'm primed for that backward name, though the double-S to start kind of gives it away. Unless he's a snake.)
ReplyDeleteAsked myself the same question when I saw "Ssur".
DeleteAccording to mobygames, one of the playtesters was a Russ Smith.
Same! I was Radev Talenscar in AD&D...it's not completely Vader spelled backward but it's pronounced "Ray-Dev" and that sounded better than Redav.
DeleteOkay, last comment. Lions, tigers, *and* bears? Oh my! I'm wondering if they're just tough, or if you're supposed to get tricky. Maybe one needs to 1) throw apples at them, 2) scare them off with a scarecrow, or 3) recruit a tin woodsman for the fight?
ReplyDeleteThis does seem like an early foreshadowing of Pool of Radiance. The Dragon treasure hoard reminded me of the Kobold king's hoard, albeit more useful in the former case. I especially liked the Bragandine armor. I have seen many medieval pictures, usually from the Hundred Years war era, showing that piece. It is nice to see something besides mail or plate.
ReplyDeleteAlso clearing the area from the Necromancer reminded me of the Yarash quest to stop the pollution of the Stonjanow river. I guess SSI's wargaming roots made their quest design more direct than say Wizardry or Ultima.
SSI made the best Civil War computer game, No Greater Glory. There is even some light roleplaying in it. If you play the North, you must decided if you can stomach putting Simon Cameron at the War Dept. simply because he clinched the Republican nomination for you? He is the most incompetent possible cabinet appointee, but also the most politically powerful.
"Unfortunately, like in The Terminator, only organic tissue can survive the portal, so they can't bring any weapons or armor. On the other side, they get equipped with non-magic versions of their favorite gear."
DeleteThis reminds me of the transition to the other planes in 'Pools of Darkness' during which most magical items (would) get destroyed (as a plot device / game mechanic excuse to nerf your party). Except you had to bring your (non-magical) replacement gear yourself (BYOG). Maybe that's where this idea originated at SSI?
Three highly interesting posts in a row. Thanks, am looking forward to know how et and mt2 develop!
ReplyDeleteI'm glad to see you're enjoying the game so far. One thing you'll find out (or may have already found out) is that magic is much more powerful because casters with over 250 skill can often cast two or three spells in one turn. This makes spells like "Create Terrain" and the low-difficulty damage spells much more useful than in the first one. I suggest playing with every spell in the list to find interesting tactics for some of the tougher combats.
ReplyDeleteThe 3 mages/3 priests restriction can be circumvented by importing a party from Wizard's Crown. One of my parties from Wizard's Crown had six priests, making some of the longer dungeons much easier.
One subtle thing about both Wizard's Crown and The Eternal Dagger is that as you slay the same monster types, they become less common as random encounters and they also give you less experience points per kill.
Have you considered using some keyboard mapping software or a macro program to remap the movement keys to the numpad or something? Having to constantly figure out which number moves which direction seems like it would slow down gameplay a bit.
ReplyDeleteAs a kid I just drew the arrows on the c64 keyboard.
DeleteOh, sure, I could always do something like that, but unless a game is absolutely unplayable, I prefer to play it with constraints similar to what players of the time would have suffered.
DeleteHave you considered remapping your keyboard to be closer to an Apple 2, C64, etc keyboard? I know some of them had more then slightly different layouts.
DeleteGenerally, in cases like this, the keys don't magically make sense on the old hardware - it was a clumsy makeshift 30 years ago because the more convenient key groups we're used to today simply did not exist on those platforms.
DeleteRemapping would not help in the least, largely because the emulators already remap the keys in the first place.
Other part might be historicity. SSI started to use this method of navigation around 1980, so if they shuffle it up, it would be unusual for their regular audience.
DeleteI've been looking forward to posts on the Eternal Dagger since Chet opened up the blog to non-IBM PC games. I remember really enjoying this one, although I never finished it as my save file got corrupted right before the end. Eleven year old me quickly learned his lesson to back up saves after that!
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure how much you rely on quick combat, but I found that tactical combat was generally much easier. Fights that were fairly trivial in tactical mode would slaughter my characters in quick mode, so I remember basically doing everything tactically unless I was really overleveled. It may have to do with the AI inefficiently using magic, since the game balance definitely favored spellcasters as Tsu pointed out. That did make the game slog a little bit and made me not want to replay it from the beginning.
As an aside, Wikipedia claims that the Dragon magazine review gave this 1.5 stars, so this may be the only game the Lessers didn't like.
I'm relying too much on quick combat. I'm going to offer a post just on the tactical combat options so I can ensure that I fully explore them all.
DeleteAnd yes, that Dragon review is amazing. I've never seen a score that low--and for a game that exemplifies tactical combat in a tabletop-style RPG. I honestly have no idea what Dragon was looking for in a computer RPG.
DeleteI remember laughing when they gave Wing Commander 6 out of 5 stars. Perhaps Eternal Dagger would have scored higher a few years later just with story-based cinematics!
DeleteThis is so great to hear you all talk about a game I loved. I played Wizards Crown when it first came out and always used the tactical combat. That's what I enjoyed about the game to me that was the point of it. Seeing how each new item and spell enhanced my ability to achieve victory. I only used quick combat when I had to do tedious grinding and the outcome was always way worse than tactical mode. Tactical I really used terrain to my advantage creating fatal funnels and focus firing. I never new about or tried the sequel "Eternal Dagger". So now I can't wait to try it! When I first played Wizards crown as a kid I never finished it cause I got hung up on not being able to defeat Golem's without the Golem staff for each character and I wasn't going to repeat those dungeons 18 times to get the three parts to make each staff. 20 years later I picked the game up again to finish it and again got stuck at the same point with golems. I can't remember if o used quick combat to get around Golems and then finished the game. I think I might have finally finished it I can't remember ha. I'll have to see if I still have the save file for those characters I'm excited to try this or start over again.
DeleteThere were some squares in Wizard's Crown that had different encounters. There was a square where you would always encounter white rabbits (tough fight, but good treasure).
ReplyDeleteThe best party is probably:
3 Fighter-Sorcerer
3 Fighter-Priest
1 Ranger
1 Thief or Fighter-Thief (I would probably pick thief and have him use the eternal dagger later on).
Of course you need to be sure to distribute slash/bash/pierce weapons due to damage immunities for some monsters.
Looks like it must have a touch of "linear fighter- quadratic mage" syndrome.
Delete"If it's successful, the party eats the game..." On first reading I did not interpret that sentence the way I think you intended me to.
ReplyDeleteHello, I was just curious what platform/software you were using to play Eternal Dagger. Been wanting to play it again, but I'm afraid my Apple IIc has long since ceased to function.
ReplyDeleteHe played Apple II version of wizard's crown and has transferred the chars here so it must be Apple II version. If i recall right he uses AppleWin emulator to play old apple games.
DeleteThat's correct. I'm playing on the Apple II using AppleWin.
DeleteI'm still working with the Atari ST version of The Wizard's Crown. It's worked very nicely, and its intuitive numeric keypad movement eliminates one of Chet's major gripes with the game. It took a few minutes to get the Atari ST "steem" emulator running, but all the needed items and instructions are available on the
ReplyDeletehttp://steem.atari.st site. Having never used the ST, I didn't know anything about the experience they were emulating, but steem seemed fairly intuitive.
That Dragon looks like a disappointing house lizard.
ReplyDeleteHello there, I used to love this game on my parents apple iigs back in the day. Heard any news on a working emulator version of it?
ReplyDeleteAn Apple IIGS version of The Eternal Dagger is quite easily discoverable through your favorite search engine. We unfortunately do not link to such locations on this blog.
Delete